I read your post. Gave myself some time to digest it. Like a big meal … there’s a lot in that to address.
First, it’s always helpful to define your use of “words” to ensure that readers understand the meaning of what you are communicating. This is important on an international forum because not everyone has the same experience, history, understanding that locals (area, culture) have.
I start, after reading something, to break it down and do my best (with my own understanding of history, social evolution, acknowledging my own bias, etc) to sift out the “issue” and at least offer up some form of “action” (to move towards “better”).
Much of your post could be broken down into thread discussions, because there are many social issues that do effect us globally (directly or indirectly). And each country, political system, social system, culture etc (perhaps through different approaches) can and do offer “better” as well as (depending on ideological, cultural, religious, political, etc) “worse”.
@Antideist Provide evidence that the US Constitution is based on any religious text or scripture, which is supposedly the word of God. I have read it, and none of it mentions anything religious in nature. You are just trying to use secular things, as proof of the existence of whatever God or Gods that you believe in, by claiming that the US Constitution has a religious origin. Yeah…not happening.
@BigNeerav The simplest and shortest counter to this assumption is that if the US was founded on christian values, they would have included all of the ten commandments into the Constitution and laws.
@David_Killens Precisely. We would have seen elements of Christianity in the US Constitution, if this country was founded on religious terms, as @Antideist claims, but it is not. #EpicFail
I refer you to article 11 of The Treaty Of Tripoli. Ratified by the US Senate unanimously without debate and signed into law by President John Adams in 1797.
Article 11 reads:
‘As the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion, - as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion or tranquility of Musselmen, - and as the said States never have entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mehomitan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries.’
One completely retarded comment after another. The people in the United States were escaping religious oppression. They came to America to avoid persecution. You actually think they thought starting a new state religion and oppressing each other was a good idea?
What you had in America was a whole lot of little religious communities who realized they must join together for mutual protection. No community was willing to give up control or power to another community. No community was willing to allow another RELIGIOUS COMMUNITY to have power over them. The result of this was that all the little religious communities came together and created a completely SECULAR GOVERNMENT. A separation of church and state.
I thought that was factually true Boomer.
"Many of the Pilgrims were members of a Puritan sect known as the Separatists. They believed that membership in the Church of England violated the biblical precepts for true Christians, and they had to break away and form independent congregations that adhered more strictly to divine requirements. A passage from the Second Epistle of Paul to the Corinthians gave urgency to their actions.
The early american zealots were quite insane… from what I have read.
The Separatists’ faith experience was part of the larger English Reformation of the 16th century. This movement sought to “purify” the Church of England of its corrupt human doctrine and practices; the people in the movement were known as “Puritans.” Separatists were those Puritans who no longer accepted the Church of England as a true church, refused to work within the structure to affect changes, and “separated” themselves to form a true church based solely on Biblical precedent. Puritans rejected Christmas, Easter and the various Saint’s Days because they had no scriptural justification, and in their worship services, they rejected hymns, the recitations of the Lord’s Prayer and creeds for the same reason.
LOL - Imagine what government would have been like if these folks actually had a hand in it. There certainly would not have been a Christmas Break on the Calendar. Many colonists came to America from England to escape religious persecution during the reign of King James I (r. 1603–1625) and of Charles I (r. … Freedom of religion and freedom of speech or of the press were as foreign to the Puritans as to the Church of England.
And the assertion from “Antideist” was that these ignorant cunts had something to do with setting up the US government. They made the USA a nation founded on their religious bullshit. (FACE PALM).
Founded by possibly, and I’d be dubious even that was true of all the founding fathers. Though they certainly created a constitution that made it clear no government had the write to create any laws in relation to religious beliefs.
Well not publicly anyway, but even this is too sweeping a claim IMHO.
I’m not sure American politicians try to sell secularism would have much of a career.
Indeed not, people don’t simply give up their religious beliefs and religions don’t simply quietly sulk while secularist movements neuter them.
@Cognostic That is what I was also taught, since there in England, there was no separation between religion and the State, which is what Evangelical Christians want, here in the United States.
Really? I didn’t know that. Care to name a dozen or so? Even Donald Trump went through motions to present himself as a Christian.
Again, pardon my ignorance, I didn’t know that. I’ve been under the impression that private schools of all kinds in the US are self funding.IE the money comes from the parents not the tax payer.
I have read that public education in the US has been in crisis for decades. As a group, politicians tend to support policies of which their voters approve and stay in government.
I suspect there are many reasons for the failure of pubic education in the US. They might include an anti education bias by many Americans. Plus the peculiarly American version of Libertarianism which runs very deep. Such sentiments tend not to support areas of social justice. Eg tax funded health, education and welfare.
I think it may also be argued that a deep vein of puritanism also runs through much of American society , along with an almost as deep systemic racism.
I think there’s some truth in your claim, but only some.
… there’s a lot in that to address.