@Old_man_shouts_at_cl I’m sorry. Around this time each night I am usually making dinner. Then my husband and I watch a movie and eat together. I will respond to this as soon as I can!
No hurry Tia, I am in Australia…so I am used to timing delays.
1 Like
In what way is that different from Buddhism which came 400 years before jesus? I hope you are familiar with others religions, because you are making a comparison. For a fair and balanced philosophy on how other religions espouse on how we conduct ourselves, we must be familiar with those religions.
Seriously, I doubt you can defend this claim. There are approximately 10,000 other distinct religions, have you eliminated all of them?
Only jesus? See above.
So what are we talking about, how to practice the Golden Rule (which applies to other human beings) or how to worship this god?
FYI, even if this god was real, I would not bend my knee, it is a psychotic murderous monster devoid of morals. I am much more concerned about how we treat fellow human beings, not some god who created us as playthings that are supposed to be supplicants to it’s ego.
Have you ever asked this question to yourself… why would such an all powerful deity need to create pets that worship it?
We know how this loving god treats humans, it kills them (great Flood, etc.) or condemns them to eternal torture if they displease it.
3 Likes
We already discussed the doctrine of Jesus and you just completely skipped over it. There is no ‘Doctrine of Jesus.’ There are 'Stories about Jesus" made up by religious zealots. You have nothing more than that. You can not demonstrate Jesus ever existed. You can not demonstrate he was crucified. You certainly can not demonstrate he was crucified on a cross. All of this is mere social convention brought about by the socially accepted norms of the time and the unlimited and unquestionable power of a ruthless and dogmatic Church.
2 Likes
Should there be a “doctrine” of Jesus (I’m with Cog - there isn’t) and should it be “love,” that’s not a doctrine I’m willing to subscribe to at any rate.
This is because we’re talking about a compulsory love, in my observation. “Love me, God/Jesus, or else.” In other words one must love an eternal father while simultaneously fearing him.
The sheer immorality of that is thankfully distracting me from the utter manipulation of it.
And this isn’t even touching upon the deranged idea of loving one’s enemies, the practice of non-resistance to evil - a morally and culturally suicidal idea that is the province of those who’ve been fortunate enough to have been protected from enemies bent on their destruction, IMHO.
One can keep this revolting and doctrinaire (and nonexistent) policy principle, thank you very much.
4 Likes
Whoa-whoa-whoa!.. 
… A gentleman??? Hey, no need to get all nasty about it and throw insults around. Anybody here sees that, they might start getting the wrong idea about me. Let’s just try to keep things civil, okay?.. (addressing forum… nervous chuckle)… Ha-ha… Okay, everybody, no need for alarm! Tia was just joking about the whole “gentleman” thing!.. (nervous chuckle)… Ha-ha… Good one, Miss Tia. Had me goin’ there for a minute… Ha-ha…
So, uh, anyway, I’m finally settled in for the evening. Let’s seeee… Where was I… (searching thread)… Oh, here we go…
Ah. Okay. So, you had a close brush with death that started you thinking. Shortly after, you had a lengthy traumatic experience with a “mentally unstable” ex, causing an overload of stress and anxiety. Then, during that time, a trusted friend read a passage from the bible that provided you with a much needed relief from that mental suffering. Yep, a perfect recipe for being sucked in to the Christian faith. It typically does prey upon the weak and vulnerable. Consider this, however. Had your friend read you something similar from the Koran (affecting you the same as the bible passage), would you now be a Muslim? Or something similar from any of the other “holy books” out there? Would you be a Hindu, or maybe a Buddhist? As others have already said, Christianity (the bible) does not have a monopoly on teachings that help people live a good life.
-
I can understand not wanting to be self-serving and (I imagine) an arrogant ass. What is wrong with being cynical, though? In the right amount, being cynical can be a positive quality. Can help keep you from being duped. Can prevent having people take advantage of you. (But I digress…)
-
Why did you decide/believe you needed some sort of god to help you be a better person? Based on your writing abilities and professed interests, you seem fairly intelligent. Nothing stopping you from being a good person on your own merits.
Again, sorry. You cannot have it both ways. You have already agreed the bible was “composed” by a PERFECT GOD, as his PERFECT MESSAGE, for all of Mankind. Now you say MAN (“those councils of old”) had to sort through GOD’S PERFECT WORDS and decide for themselves what was suitable for the masses (a vast majority being completely illiterate). You stated earlier you do believe God is All-knowing, All-powerful, and PERFECT. Whether you realize it or not, by stating the bible had to be “edited”/“filtered” by Man, you successfully negated all those powers attributed to that God. You also stated earlier that sources other than the bible can/should be sought to obtain wisdom/knowledge. As I pointed out, that is going against those PERFECT WORDS of God that say the BIBLE should be the ONLY source of “spiritual wisdom/knowledge”. Again, you contradict the beliefs you claim to have about your God. And, chances are, you are not even aware you are doing so. Moving right along…
I saw something Dave wrote about worshipping the god of the bible. I’d like to expand on that a bit, if I may. You have children (child?) and a husband, right? It’s a good bet you love your children more than you love yourself. There is nothing you wouldn’t do to protect them and provide a good life for them, right? And, at present, you are the ruler of their world and life. So, how often do you make them bow down and worship you each day? How often do you make them pray to you and ask your forgiveness for mistakes they make? And if they do not worship you and love you as much as you think they should, what type of hellish torture do you tell them they will suffer for their transgressions against you? You absolutely and unconditionally love them, of course. But if they do not worship you and bow at you feet daily, you really have no choice but to punish them in the most agonizing ways imaginable.
And your husband? No doubt he loves you very much. So, he makes you worship him, right? Forces you to love him in return? He watches every single move you make, every minute, of every day, and demands that you bow down to him and never ever even remotely THINK about not loving him. If you should ever stop loving him, or (even WORSE) try to leave him, he will hunt you down and torture you in a most horrible manner. But, remember, he TOTALLY LOVES YOU unconditionally the whole time he is torturing you. It just makes him a little sad that you forced him to do that to you. (By the way, in case you haven’t figured it out yet, that is the god you claim to follow and praise. With one exception, though. The god of the bible is MUCH WORSE.)
Okay, enough for now. Post is getting too long. More later when I get a chance.
(Edited for minor spelling/punctuation errors)
5 Likes
You want Love: J. Krishnamurti does a much better job of it than does Jesus. (He had a dogma, a world view, a doctrine, and it was all bullshit.) LOVE is complete bullshit. It can not be defined. A billion hateful acts, including the glorious creation of Hell, have been done in the name of love. Fuck Love.
I long ago figured out that J. Krishnamurti was full of shit and dropped him like a hot banana and he was instrumental in getting me to drop Buddhism for the coconut bullshit that it was.
There is no peace of mind in ‘love.’ Love is a delusion. When you think you feel love, it is not another person’s love you feel or the love of the world around you that you feel. You can NOT feel the love of another. Love is a projection. Like anger, there is a right time, a right way, a right degree, and a right place to express it. Failure to recognize that will cause you nothing but heartache and misery. Universal love leads to martyrdom and that is just stupid. Delusional people love while the pack of wild dogs rip them apart. Jim Jeffries on unconditional love of God or other species. - YouTube
Jesus is an ass… If I don’t love him for not showing up or demonstrating his existence he will burn me in hell for eternity. Fuck Jesus and his conditional bullshit.
3 Likes
Personally, this is my takeaway.
Just sharing my perspective of the information @Tia_Thompson presents and the way it’s presented.
Like theists she has latched onto a god. She has chosen Jesus or bible god or the examples of such 
WHATEVER…. GOD has been created in her head. It’s all warm and fuzzy 
lovey and comforting. Everything life has is evidence of her mind’s creation (I remember your first posting and the miracle 
)
This is easily done BECAUSE whatever she wants to gleam as a belief is easily accomplished by making things symbolic or just stories or emotional 🥹
SO, the “bible” is a collection of writings with lies and fables and plagiarism and rules and politics OF MAN and their claims it’s from GOD.
Ancient humankind’s social evolution, with such limited knowledge, had invisible deities in everything - superstition… what harm? Hahahaha. YOU are well aware of the harm this book does.
So your Jesus is specific to you. Big deal. I believe evidenced claims. People who encounter aliens share their stories too. Some of those folks even are on the Galactic Counsel. People share their past-life experiences and read from the Akashic records when they’re OBE. Some pink-haired lady posts videos telling us all about her visits in heaven and talking with god.
Keep doing you. BUT this nonsense is a crutch. The only one deciding to be a loving ethical person is you.
2 Likes
My question is simple.
What standard for evidence do you set for yourself to believe something?
1 Like
Standard??? It feels good.
I hope that you are having a pleasant evening. The sun is just beginning to rise here. Soon it will be a sweltering, Memphis day.
This is a question/concept posed several different ways on this forum. For the sake of time and fairness, I will tell you what I think about “my Jesus-figure’s” death on another post. Some of this I have never considered outside my own experience. It is a new and interesting sensation to relate a portion of these thoughts to another person, especially one with a critical eye and mind. Thank you for your time and your informative comments and concerns.
Indeed. Maybe there are even more than that. But as far as I have found, only the doctrine of Jesus teaches that loving each other is how we show love for God.
I respect and believe many aspects of Buddhism. It’s not really a religion anymore. It is more of a practice or a discipline. But, I believe it still contains many useful axioms for a peaceful existence.
Yes. But, I am open to you presenting a different doctrine or religion that teaches that to love each other (regardless of person) as the way to show love for God.
That would bring me great joy.
Both.
As I have stated elsewhere. Many people have and still do kill and do atrocious things in the name of God. But according to the teachings of Jesus, to love God is to love each other. This is the greatest commandment. All the law and the prophets hang from this “commandment”. (Matthew 22:36-40) and if we do not show love we do not know God. (1 John 5:3)
According to the doctrine of Jesus, anyone, even people contained in religious scripture who do not follow a path of unbiased, universal love as characterized in 1 Corinthians 13, and other places such as but not limited to Luke 10:25-37 (which addresses national and liturgical bias) are exempted as knowing God, even if they qualify their atrocious acts by their own warped interpretation of God’s will.
This was a revolutionary concept in ancient times. In many ways it still is. According to the gospels, people sought Jesus’ death for insinuating such things.
I’m not overtly superstitous. I do not believe this, even if a man wrote it searching for God. The truth of something stands, no matter what is thrown at it. What is false falls away, as it rightly should.
For a scriptural reference, I think of 1 Kings 19:11,12:
And, behold, the LORD passed by, and a great and strong wind rent the mountains, and brake in pieces the rocks before the LORD; but the LORD was not in the wind: and after the wind an earthquake; but the LORD was not in the earthquake: 12And after the earthquake a fire; but the LORD was not in the fire: and after the fire a still small voice.
I know that still small voice.
I notice you keep repeating how we should “show love for God.” Yet, when I and others have repeatedly demonstrated how the God you follow is a horrendous tyrant, you keep avoiding/ignoring or deflecting away from it. So, why would I (or anybody else, for that matter) want to show love for such an oppressive being?
Again, whether you realize it or not, you have negated your claim of believing the God of the bible is Perfect and that the bible that same God dictated is perfect. You continue to contradict your own beliefs.
With all due respect, y’all have only repeatedly demonstrated the atrocities committed by men who waved misrepresented flags of divinity while they do the exact opposite of what the doctrine they profess instructs.
I repeatedly refer to the doctrine of Jesus because it clarifies these misrepresentations for what they are. It doesn’t matter who wrote it down to me. Whoever it was understood something profound.
The most important commandments are to love God and each other.
To love God.is to follow His commandments.
The most important commandments are to love God and each other.
To love God is to love each other.
Anyone that does not love does not know God.
How many other religions have you examined? By what criteria have you eliminated the other 10,000 religions? This may be a mind-f–k to you, but the Satanic Temple does a much, much better job at loving others.
Golden Rule? First off, I do have problems getting past that because I lack a belief in your god. But even if the bible is true, the love your god offers to you is conditional. If you give love, your god reciprocates. If you do not, your god definitely does not offer unconditional love but responds by torturing or killing you and your loved ones.
I have a Pug. I have raised many dogs over the years. When she was a puppy and still in training, if she made a mistake and (for example) peed on the carpet, I did not punish her, I realized it was on me, I was not training her properly and I also understood that training takes time and patience. I am much better at loving my dog than your god is at loving you.
One mistake by an untrained Eve and mankind is doomed to forever be born into sin? And women suffer the pain of childbirth? Do you understand how f–ked up that is?
Love each other? Many of your fellow jesus lovers hate gays, blacks, the list is a long and sordid one.
You made the claim that out of over 10,000 religions, the doctrine of your jesus does set it apart. You must prove this claim, I challenged your assertion. it is not up to me to prove anything, it is up to you.
I common parlance, you are attempting to reverse the burden of proof.
I am an atheist and lack a belief in a god. I am willing to take a bullet to protect my wife, whom I love. Please explain that.
1 Like
Did I say I disbelieve the insightful parts of the Quran?
With the exception of the doctrine of Jesus, (wherein it is stated that to love each other is the greatest of all commandments and that to love each other is how we should show our love for God)
I view most holy scriptures in much the same way. I have thought to include passages from other religions, but it seems our hands are currently full with those of Christianity.
This is why I identify with Christianity, but Christianity became CHRISTIANITY with Paul. You can literally tell when his own ideas enter the doctrine, like a fingerprint. I know “Paul” is a real personage because of this. Writing is an art form. When you know the artist you recognize them, even if they use a different style. You recognize their instruction, even if a student emulates them
This is a No true scotsman fallacy. Try again.
1 Like
In the name of personal privacy, I suggest you edit out her name in the image, or delete it.
2 Likes