Why do they believe?

He seems pretty bent out of shape that we didn’t all fall to our knees and repent, when he started reeling off unevidenced claims and logical fallacies.

Also and no offence, he doesn’t seem keen to learn about the basic errors in reasoning and debate that he’s making, which suggests he still laughably thinks he’s presenting a compelling case for his unevidenced beliefs.

You just never know, but I’d say we haven’t seen the last logical fallacy, or bare claim from @Sid .

I mean he could have Googled most of the howlers he posted himself, and seen how wrong he was. Like his gem that consensus plays no part in science.

He’s going to blow an artery when he finds out about Talk Origins’ index of creationist claims (and rebuttals thereof). That list is extensive to put it mildly, and demonstrates that a large number thereof are decades old, but still being peddled as if they constitute some sparkling brand of “wisdom” by the usual suspects, with which they’re going to "stick it to the stoopid atheists™ ".

That’s in addition to some of the material I’ve compiled over the years, and which has undergone a recent update.

Of course, the usual suspects never learn from the fact that their canards have been shredded right down to their constituent quarks, or that we’ve known about these canards for a long time.

Though my comments here in the past about the mentally corrosive effects of apologetics also have a bearing on the matter.

You want atheists to provide you with rational augments for your beliefs that they don’t share? Come on, even you must see the rank stupidity of that request? Also you’re lying yet again, both the logical fallacies and the principles of logic have nothing to do with us, we just happen to have a passing understanding of them, unlike you, and don’t accept claims that are irrational, again unlike you.

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha … What didn’t he get about the definition of Atheism? We are atheists because no argument or evidence for the existence of god has yet met its burden of proof. Duh! Someone needs to kick this guy in his chakra and wake him up.

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Everything…

Oh, hang on, I’d like a piece of this action as well … :smiley:

How about your cartoon magic man putting in an appearance and saying “hello” to the planet, in a manner that would be impossible to fake? Possibly including such antics as temporarily relocating the International Space Station, before replacing it back in its proper orbit? Say, arranging for the ISS to take a tour of the developed world at a low enough altitude for millions of people to point their phone cameras at it, as well as TV news crews and radar stations to detect this, while at the same time, your cartoon magic man makes itself visible for the duration while holding the ISS in its hand? That would be pretty difficult to fake.

In other words, what would count as proper evidence, would be:

[1] an observable and measurable phenomenon;

[2] one thus observable and measurable by a large number of people, including professional scientists;

[3] one which has no explanation in terms of testable natural processes,

[4] which is vastly different in nature from all previous observed and measured phenomena, and

[5] which is impossible for us to fake using technology.

That’s going to be a pretty tall order, fulfilling all of those criteria. Perhaps that’s why mythology fanboys prefer to try and conjure their cartoon magic man into existence with apologetic spells.

We leave those to you. Such as your fake accusation of “appeal to authority” when I posted pages from a book containing known and readily demonstrable factual content. Here’s a clue for you: I wasn’t relying upon any “credentials” the author might have had, but upon his presentation of factual reportage, covering a phenonemon that has been reliably and repeatedly observed by millions of tropical fishkeepers over the past century.

Oh, by the way, “fallacy” is a noun with an irregular plural, and English nouns with regular plurals never use apostrophes.

By the way, what is it with mythology fanboys and superfluous capitalisation?

It’s a baffling trend, maybe it’s something they teach in religious apologetics 101?

All theoretically possible, with an extra terrestrial species that is a type 2 or above on the Kardashev scale.

How about a shred of objective evidence a deity is even possible, or one argument that isn’t based on a logical fallacy? Though I see your point, if it has limitless knowledge to create a message, and limitless power to communicate it, then why do we get errant nonsense (falsified by human science in a few hundred years), that suspiciously reflects the ignorance, prejudice and superstition of the epoch that created it?

The most extraordinary of claims, cannot be waved in with the weakest of “evidence” and irrational arguments…call me sceptical but…no just call me sceptical.

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They believe, because they have FREEWILL just like you do to believe whatever they want to believe. Your wife and believers choose to believe there IS A GOD, and you and others like you have chosen not to believe…“To each his/her own” as the saying goes.

May I ask why you do not believe that God exist?

Try because we don’t bother with “belief” full stop, as practised by mythology fanboys. We only accept postulates enjoying evidential support.

No one has ever supported the assertion that a god type entity of any sort exists, with genuine evidence. All we’ve had thus far can be summarised as “my mythology says so”, with a large side salad of ex recto apologetic fabrications.

Now if you have something better than this to offer, the first question to be asked is why are you posting here, instead of taking your evidence to a peer reviewed academic journal?

Hey, way the attack and harsh and unfriendly tone of voice. I here to discuss biblical topics so that I and hopefully others may learn and grow spiritually. I am NOT here to argue and fight with you or anyone. Okay? Just friendly mature conversation.

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YOU don’t get to set the tone. Each person here can set whatever tone they desire as long as it doesn’t digress into hate speech (as defined by Canadian law).

If you don’t like the tone - leave :woman_shrugging:t2:

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Hi @HalleluYah, can you explain which deity are you referring to, and what objective evidence, if any, you can demonstrate that it exists, or is even possible? After all you don’t believe in nearly all the deities I don’t, except one. What is your criteria for disbelieving those thousands of deities exist?

My criteria for belief is that sufficient objective evidence be demonstrated to support the belief.

You have to realise that while people are respected here, beliefs must stand on their own merits, no one is obliged to respect a belief, indeed I bet there are many you don’t respect, for example how do you feel about the beliefs of ISIS or the KKK? I’m not comparing those to yours necessarily, just pointing out that beliefs cannot be ringfenced from critical scrutiny, religious or otherwise.

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I’m certain I just asked the same question in another thread.

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Christians can’t even agree how to worship with the same instruction manual.

Lutherans, Methodists, Presbyterians, Quakers, Baptists, Southern Baptists, Freewill Southern Baptists, Episcopaleans, Christian Scientists, The Church of England, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Seventh-Day Adventists, Apostolics, and Pentacostalists (among many, many others) all worship quite differently, and have very different value systems despite having the same book.

The Jehovah’s Witnesses (for example) believe that anyone who isn’t a Jehovah’s Witness will not see paradise and–instead–will remain dead when God resurrects the faithful. It is similar with the many other sects.

Some Christians worship with wine and unleavened bread, some do charity work, and some churches require you to handle venomous snakes.

So, even if I became a Christian now and picked one of the above religions . . . the odds are overwhelmingly against me, and I’ll likely pick the wrong one and damn myself to Hell (or eternal death and/or separation from God) despite being pious, devout, and sincerely worshipping God.

And this is only if we consider Christianity. The problem becomes worse when we consider non-Christian religions . . . although I skip these because you specifically mention the Bible.

Atheism is a perfectly reasonable . . . and even comforting choice under the circumstances.

Does it ever occur to the theist that atheism can be just as (if not more) comforting than a religion?

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‘Nobody chooses their beliefs, they are either convinced or they are not. The problem arises, when someone is convinced for poor reasons, largely due to lack of education on standards of evidence.’ - Matt Dillahunty.

Can we just appreciate, how Dillahunty puts things so efficiently, the culmination of thousands of hours of having to keep things brief, yet needing to put forth complex meaning.

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Yeah, it looks like another drive by proselytising to me. All the usual claims and logical fallacies in a scatter gun approach.

No answers, and no evidence, and then the usual bafflement that atheists won’t accept what’s on offer.

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Have you read the definition of Atheism? Have you read anything in the thread? Why do you insis on persisting in ignorance?

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Uh…hmmm. Is this by chance one of those, what is it now, don’t tell me…perhaps a rat-oracle question?

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