Okay, I’ll be honest. I was practicing my critical thinking skills on Quranic verses and was very successful in detecting bullshit until something caught me. I used the same tactic that I talked about in my last topic i.e. ‘could this knowledge be humanly acquired?’ but it failed. The claim was that Quran mentioned that mountains can float/are floating 1400 years ago and nobody could’ve known this back then.
The problem is, I can’t seem to find how this could’ve been known. What am I missing? I did my own thinking by checking off things from my BS detection list:
Could it be observed? No
Did anyone ever mention about this before Muhammad? No, I tried to search a lot.
Could it be humanly possible to find out that mountains float? No
"The mountains that you see, you think they are stationary while they are constantly floating like the floating of clouds. Such is the work of Allah Who made everything firm and strong. ” Holy Quran [27:88]
“… as a mountain range forms, it slowly sinks under the force of gravity, and the continental crust bends downward. When enough of a root bulges into the mantle to provide buoyancy, the mountain range floats.” Understanding Earth, Grotzinger & Jordan, pg. 630 (2014).*
“Like icebergs or ships in water, continents and their mountains “float” on the denser mantle. High mountains such as the Himalayas are balanced by a keel, or root, that penetrates deeper into the mantle. As the mountains are worn down by erosion, the weight of the crust is reduced, and the mountains rise. The balance between the mountains’ massive weight and their buoyancy in the mantle is one of the factors determining the height of the range.”
I give up here, I don’t know. My thinking skills are failing to help me out here. Plus, the anxiety attacks are clouding up my brain and I can’t understand where I am going wrong.
So what is it going to be? Floating or firm? Even this Quran is contradictory.
@Seek3R Please, apply critical thinking. Even the passage that has you freaked out is contradictory. Thus, this passage should be immediately disregarded as crap nonsense.
I will break it down for you. Most religious books are basically multiple choice books, where if you roam around enough, you will discover a passage that suits your intent. You want to embrace that the mountains are floating, this passage is for you. If you want to embrace the concept that mountains are set firmly, this very same passage suits your intent.
FFS please stop reading this crap. Put the book down, step back, and enjoy life instead.
If you think that examining such passages you will understand better, here is a reality check.
It’s all bullshit designed to confuse.
And you just keep walking into the same traps.
Stop reading this crap. You do not have to disprove anything.
Clouds “pass away” (dissolve or condense into rain …BUT they pass away)
Wouldn’t this be more in line with “something firm like a mountain will also “pass away”, I assume with either god’s vengeance or over time. In other words, they also don’t last forever?
In the shimmering heat of the desert the mountains in the distance can indeed appear to float. I’ve seen it myself in the American southwest. It’s possible to come to the right conclusions for the wrong reasons. Also, with the limitless scope of imagination it’s possible to totally make something up, that later turns out to have a grain of truth.
@David_Killens
But isn’t both true? Mountains are firm and also floating? The naked eye sees them firm but scientifically, they are also floating. Regardless, here’s an authentic translation:
Sahih International: And you see the mountains, thinking them rigid, while they will pass as the passing of clouds. [It is] the work of Allah , who perfected all things. Indeed, He is Acquainted with that which you do.
Okay, it’s my bad I read the piece of shit book. It traps me really quickly if I find anything that I don’t understand even after research.
But any idea why would anyone talk about floating mountains in the 7th century which also happens to be scientific truth?
I’m not defending their claim, I just want to know WHY would anyone talk about floating mountains. Was this a known information back in old times?
Religion fucks you up, and unfortunately, you are continually allowing religion to screw up your mind until you start stating such gibberish. You think you have to debunk, and once you start down that rabbit hole, you are going to get fucked up.
Walk away, you do not have to disprove anything.
That, good sir, is your failing. You believe you have to debunk religion and such nonsensical passages in a holy book.
Okay, forget what I wrote. Let’s restart. The following is the translation:
Sahih International: And you see the mountains, thinking them rigid, while they will pass as the passing of clouds. [It is] the work of Allah , who perfected all things. Indeed, He is Acquainted with that which you do.
Forget the ‘firm’ part. If someone posts that translation with a book reference that says mountains do float and that is what seems to be appearing everywhere on the internet, then what should I do if not debunk? There’s a claim with an evidence and I don’t have any alternative explanation so if I don’t debunk, that verse is the first thing that will always come in my mind whenever I read about floating mountains.
Who cares? Kellii gave a possibility. There are dozens of possibilities (a bad mushroom trip ). I’m not a writer of this book and neither are you and looking around - NO ONE ALIVE is…
Why write about upteen false things and give credit to god?
Hobbits have been mentioned throughout history as fiction in stories… now there is archeological evidence that they existed - about 50,000 yrs ago.
great…now you are using a translation that uses “floating” even though this was not apart of the “original” nor from Muhammad directly.
Wow …you have at ‘er.
Someone (when? and who?) used this word that happens to currently be used by scientists (geologists) to describe a physical occurrence… what about “roots”. Are mountain “roots” mentioned also?
My dumb guess is that it was all a metaphorical and geological fluke.
As I understand from the writings of T.E.Lawrence, Arabic is a poetic language and juxtapositions are a constant device in the creation of poetry. In an attempt to explain the ineffable qualities and nature of Allah, juxtapositions are an effective way of illustrating a deity.
Mountains are considered inconceivably heavy and immovable. “Floating mountains” is an eminently fitting way of expressing that ineffability.
So some literally creative philosopher hit on a poetic expression to describe Allah. And then it just so happens mountains physically do float on tectonic plates, which was first formally described by Alfred Wegener in his publication on plate tectonics in 1912, but which was only officially acknowledged, after a prolonged and heated debate within the global scientific community, in the mid 1960s.
Like most of the claims to foreknowledge of later scientific findings in the Quran, this is just another allegorical coincidence, an unexpected output of poetry and orology (science of mountains) unexpectedly serving theology. A fluke.
DISHONESTY so becomes you;;;;
(27:86) Do they not see that We made the night that they may rest therein and the day giving sight? Indeed in that are signs for a people who believe.
(27:87) And [warn of] the Day the Horn will be blown, and whoever is in the heavens and whoever is on the earth will be terrified except whom Allah wills. And all will come to Him humbled.
(27:88} And you see the mountains, thinking them rigid, while they will pass as the passing of clouds. [It is] the work of Allah, who perfected all things. Indeed, He is Acquainted with that which you do.
The verse says absolutely nothing about mountains 'floating." It is a verse about 'change." Everything changes. Like all apologists you are taking information about which we have knowledge of today and cramming it into the poetic verse of some past bullshit writing that seems to make some sort of sense. In short… You are reading what you want to read and not what is written.
Why don’t you try actually READING THE QUARAN! That would be a good first start and then you could see if you were given a bullshit claim by someone who merely cited half a fucking verse while attributing something miraculous to it, instead of giving you the whole verse as obvious as it fucking is.
I wish Seek3R would understand that even if such things as floating mountains and chewing gum fetus were accurately described from millennium ago, that still does not prove a god. At best, it indicates that there were some very bright minds around at that time.
Just because a person or book makes 99 completely accurate and honest statements, that does not guarantee that number 100 is true.
Muhammed also split the moon in half and put the two halves on mountains before putting it back together again. They certainly knew more about science than we do now.
There is no empirical evidence of which I’m aware of Muhammad splitting the moon in two. The effects on the earth would have been catastrophic, yet there is no contemporary evidence of such a thing ever happening. For goodness sake, look it up.
As far as I’m aware there is nothing in the Quran that was not known by scholars at that time.
For goodness sake do some reading.
“Aside from contributions by Muslims to mathematics, astronomy, medicine and natural philosophy, some have argued a very different connection between the religion of Islam and the discipline of science. Some Muslim writers have claimed that the Quran made prescient statements about scientific phenomena that were later confirmed by scientific research for instance as regards to the structure of the embryo, our solar system, and the creation of the universe.[8][9] However, much of science in Islam relies on the Quran as a basis of evidence and Islamic scientists often use one another as sources.[10] Early Muslims pursued science with an underlying assumption of confirming the Quran.[5]”
“ - these are water particles that float (fog). Been in a plane?
it also”sinks” and floats.
…BUT they pass away)
). I’m not a writer of this book and neither are you and looking around - NO ONE ALIVE is…
…you have at ‘er.