You can do better by not just making one slightly condescending post and failing to exchange in dialogue.
2 Likes
I’ve never believed in any god/gods despite being raised in a Catholic household with 3 sisters and only one bathroom. It’s all too good to be real, that’s been my belief as long as I can remember.
I’ve been married to a devoutly christian wife for 40 years next month, and I’ve heard everything that a theist would say to an atheist to try and convince them to believe at least 100 times.
All it’s done is push me even further into the reasonings for being an atheist. Preaching has the opposite effect you think you’re going to get.
1 Like
3 Likes
This strikes me mostly as being uttered by someone who thinks religious belief is a circle jerk. Do people believe for their own benefaction, satisfaction or conviction, or are they religious to satisfy the beliefs of others? If you are expecting others to be in the latter category you are imho among the circle jerkers.
2 Likes
If atheism stops with a lack of belief, why have a site where 75% of the activity is bashing and ridiculing Christians , Christianity, and debunking archeologically verified events and prophecy in the Bible?
- I seriously doubt anyone on the site has debunked any archeologically verified events.
- I seriously doubt that you can demonstrate even one biblical prophecy that has come true. A prophecy must be “Specific, to time, place, and exact event, and person.” You don’t get to spout vague amorphous language and then claim “Ah Ha! Prophecy!”
No one bashes anything until you dig in your heels and refuse to look at facts. Then a swift kick in the ass or a swat to the back of the head is sometimes needed to get things moving again. So are you just going to whine or are you going to start a thread about the Best Biblical Prophecy you know of and see what happens to it? Demonstrate any prophecy in the Bible has come true.
3 Likes
Atheism does not stop with a lack of belief, it is just the beginning. And for the many who de-converted, we seek out WHY. Why we believed, why we de-converted, and the reasons for doing so.
That leads us to go down a road where we examine religions, and what we perceive as flaws in logic and the harm religion does.
Yes, there is a lot of religion bashing. This is a human condition, where one denigrates or attacks what they perceive as the opposition. Football fans have their opponent team’s fans they attack, heck just look at English football (soccer) where fans of opposing teams must be kept separated by strong fencing and guards.
I loath using a tu quoque position, but have you ever witnessed how some theists treat atheists?
Many atheists hold the opinion that the bible and a lot of it’s contents are pure bullshit and even pure lies. For example, Moses and the Exodus have zero evidence to support it, and a lot going against it. The four gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John are unknown authors, they were not written by the four individuals who’s names are attached to them.
Many of us ascribe to the scientific method, where a topic is fiercely torn apart and dissected in order to discover any flaws. That is how science works, it does not accept flaws or gloss over anything. And that is how many approach the bible and religion.
For example …
If god is all-knowing, then god knows about evil. If god is all-good, god would not want evil. If god is all-powerful, then god could eliminate evil. But since evil exists, either god is not all-powerful (evil exists and God cannot stop it) or, god is not all-good (God has the power to eliminate evil but chooses to allow it anyway, making God malevolent.)
From Ben Smith https://www.quora.com/What-are-some-of-the-biggest-flaws-in-the-Bible-that-ruin-the-concept-of-God
2 Likes
Which one? Please give me your best example and see if it holds water.
2 Likes
Prophecy has been archeologically verified? Oh please give examples.
4 Likes
@Richeydale67 hasn’t delivered the Burden of Proof on his many other list of claims that he’s made in other threads. Let alone he refuses to demonstrate objective evidence for the existence of a deity. He constantly makes Monchausen Trillema Fallacy or tries to argue imaginary evidence that he “believes” that he has. But when it comes time for him to back his claim, he can’t do it. Where is his evidence? My word! it was in his head.
I all fairness we must hear it. But in all fairness it must meet the requirements and definition of a “prophecy” (accurate in time location, and event), and subject to examination.
I also request he brings his best argument, I am not going to go around and around countering endless propositions he is making in the hope that if you throw enough shit against the wall eventually something will stick.
@Richeydale67 I hope you do not drag out the debunked “the Jews returned home after the diaspora”. If I predict I am going to have a steak for dinner, then go to a restaurant and order one, that is not a prediction because I caused it to happen. And the Jews caused it to happen (their return).
Bring your best argument.
1 Like
Holy shit, what is that noise? My ears are starting to bleed…Oh, yeah it’s the fucking whining coming from Richeydale67
Yup, after thousands of years theists enjoyed writing the rules and controlling society and murdering and burning at the stake anyone who disagrees with them, they now play the victim card at any push-back.
4 Likes
Never tell an Atheist you’ll pray for them. Never tell them that “Jesus died for your sins”. Never threaten an Atheist with “hell”. Don’t preach. Don’t quote scripture.Don’t make religious claims that you can’t back.
“But since evil exists “ ?
That is making a moral judgement which makes no sense unless it is based on a moral standard . If evil is nothing more than a value judgement then it has no standard to define it and it can’t exist as an absolute .
Not a good example to make your point . Sid
Ah, wondered when this sort of post would turn up …
Actually, if we’re being rigorous, atheism consists of suspicion of unsupported mythology fanboy assertions. That is IT.
Moving on …
Oh dear.
First of all, we have plenty of your ilk coming here, thinking that they’re going to "stick it to the stupid atheists™ ", only to learn the hard way that what they think consists of killer “gotcha’s” and ineffable wisdom, is actually a steaming pile of coprolitic canards that have been repeatedly destroyed before. Though the veterans here are used to the level of indolence mythology fanboys display, when they don’t bother to check if their canards have already been dealt with. No, instead, they think they’re bringing sparklingly original intellectual insight to the table, when instead they’re bringing ex recto apologetic fabrications that we’ve seen here time and again, and which in many cases an astute five year old child would point and laugh at.
Second, given that the mythology your religion is based upon, contains numerous assertions that are known not merely to be wrong, but fatuous and absurd into the bargain, treatment of said assertions as purportedly constituting fact deserves ridicule.
Third, most of the events asserted to have taken place in your mythology, are not “archaeologically verified”, they’re fabrications. It won’t take you long to find genuine archaeologists who will tell you this, if you exert the effort to track them down. As for “prophesy”, pardon me for laughing at this, because quite simply, it’s horseshit.
Oh, by the way, don’t think of posting a Gish Gallop of blind assertions that require a 50,000 word dissertation to dismantle, as this will merely enhance the perception here that you’re basically dishonest. The diligent will dismantle your Gish Gallop if you try it on here, but they’ll do it piece by piece. Though of course this tactic is deployed by duplicitous pedlars of apologetics, so that they can falsely claim “victory” if the entire pile of garbage isn’t destroyed in one fell swoop. Yes, we’ve been there, done that, seen the film, watched the TV show, listened to the soundtrack, bought the T-shirt and eaten the pie (that last part is a Watership Down reference for those with a divergent take on comedy).
You want to start an apologetic knife fight here, bring one assertion to the table, and watch it being shredded.
@David_Killens (Hold on. I’ve got this one.)
Howdy, Sid. Perhaps this will better suit your tastes, since you apparently did not catch the obvious point Dave was trying to make, because you seem more concerned with semantics.
“But since incredibly horrible and detestable illnesses and acts of violence are allowed to be inflicted upon countless innocent people each and every single day around the globe…”
There. Is that better for you?
1 Like
Can you explain—in general (not just for the topic of evil)—why something being a value judgement means it has no standards to define it? Perhaps you could give some examples where there are standards (for non value judgements) and examples where there are no standards.
Fair enough, a valid question.
I do have a moral standard, that it is measured by harm and well-being. I care about my well being, for my loved ones, even my nation. If myself, loved ones and nation do not enjoy well being, we will all suffer and probably die.
@Sid Do you agree or disagree that well being is a valid metric?
Of course that is a subjective standard. With that anchor of “well-being”, then we can begin to apply objective standards to determine if it should be applied. For example, is the application of vaccines moral? Collect the data and do the math. Many more people benefit from vaccines, their well being is sustained. The non-application of vaccines results in many more deaths and suffering.
3 Likes