Surprise me! Debate? We’ll see between White and Muslim

Thread started.

I’ll just ask that members read. Won’t stop anyone from posting, BUT a kind request to discuss the Quran was tossed my way, and I accepted.

Go ahead - you start @QuranMuslim19 … I suggest you start with the best!

First, why don’t you believe in the Quran?

Depends what you mean by “believe”. Firstly, does the Quran exist as a written book? Yup. It’s evidenced. I can google search and read it.

The claim it was written by god (or inspired or however you link it to god’s word) is what I have no confidence in.

Bring Quran verses stating that the Quran is not the word of God. For what verses do you think there is no word of God?

Is that all it takes? A verse from the book itself claiming to be god’s word?

IF so…then does that standard hold for all the books claiming to be from god? Like, can I do it for the Quran and the Bible and the Book of Mormon or find Egyptian or Sumerian claims also?

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You don’t understand me. I say: On what verses do you say, “The Quran is not the word of God”?

So based on the x verse, the Quran is not the word of God. You say?

No, I understand you perfectly.

I don’t think :thinking: any book could claim to be from god and NOT have that written within its pages.

So, if this is the standard - writing the disclaimer “this book is the written word of god” THEN I need to know… cause I highly doubt the Quran doesn’t claim to be god’s word.

In other words… so I say “I won’t bother looking for that type of verse. I grant that the Quran says it’s god’s word.” Going into this I took it as a given that you have confidence that it is.

I’m saying, “so what?” Other books claim that too. Is this just your standard? Like if I show you that the bible is gods word all scripture does that mean it is? OR the Book of Mormon? Etc… would you say “ahhhh!!! Great! I never thought of that!!!”

If x says “this is the word of God” in the book, of course one should not believe it. What are the verses you criticize?

I believe the Quran is a book written by man. I don’t believe (or have confidence) that it is anything beyond what man would or could write.

I can’t say I have any “criticisms” of what is written, but am critical of claims surrounding what some feel it “says”.

Tell you what - you’re convinced, so something must have “convinced” you. You had said in the other thread of a miracle of sorts.

I have no idea what it could be.

Why don’t you tell me about it (or where I could find it in the Quran) or give me what convinces you the most?

I have a bit of work to do.

I’ll be back.

I will recommend a book to you, I recommend that you buy that book. The book talks about 19 miracle of the Quran. I checked it myself on my computer and realized something amazing was happening. I was a Deist person before, 19 miracles of the Quran caused me to believe in the Quran.

Can you just explain the argument for those of us following this? What does 19 prove about anything?


NOPE… I agreed to discuss/debate with YOU - NOT a book or author. How about your author and the author of “The God Delusion” go at it and we watch???

So, YOU. You can describe it can’t you? Or are you only convinced by another person’s words? If that’s the depth of what “convinces” you, I share this without sarcasm…

You’ll need to start asking yourself “am I interested in what is true”?

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It proves that the Quran is a mathematical book. It also proves that it is sent by God (man cannot do this). It’s not numerology. I am someone who is interested in mathematics and science. There are letters “hurufu mukatta” in the Quran. For example, like Elif-Lam-Mim. Here we explain them with 19 systems. Many people like me studied 19 systems and believed. When I was a deist, I believed. I would continue to be a deist if I hadn’t witnessed 19 miracles.

I am a truth seeker and I think it has come true. Get the book I recommend and read it. Do not approach with prejudice. The religion of the Qur’an and the religion of the Muslims are very different. They live religion with hadith nonsense. There is no such thing as Muhammad’s hadiths. Muhammad just left the Quran. Fraudsters like Bukhari-Muslim fabricated hadiths on behalf of Muhammad.

I studied Arabic so I have some sense of what you’re talking about with the letters, but I’m not following you. You have to be more precise, what convinced you? I don’t see anything convincing in your post. What are these miracles?

I’m not going to buy the book dude, I’m not. It sounds hoaky. It sounds unbelievable.

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Is this like the “Bible Code” stuff??? God hiding messages that aren’t found easily?

IT IS You have went off the words of the Quran to something apparently “hidden”, like SOOOOO MANY!

I have found messages in my CookBook! Seriously. A few months back, showed a Christian the same thing that they are claiming about their book!

The bible has pi!!! The Quran only has the number 19??? God is weird :crazy_face:

The picture I’m going to show you isn’t even 10% of the 19 miracles. But I hope you will be interested.