I would like to go over my perception of my reality, why I came to certain conclusions, and how they might be wrong. We’ll start with the big fish. I’m a Nontheistic luciferian and I’m probably the only open person who will activly claim this. Usually the occult hides their real world view behind secrets such as being part of a certain society or religious sect. I as a true slef initiate don’t fallow such pleasantries and believe we’re are beyond the age of secrets. I recognize this will challenge you to think that I’m ranting as a mad man but the occult is very real. Anyways I’m also a strict follower of science and am a preforming magician not in terms of the supernatural but as an artist. Most scientific advances have come from magic and the need to preform and inspire. Our first computer was based on multiple people’s work but the turk was the catalyst the drove us forward. As a magician i have learned that everything as a secret and every one. I’ve studied “magik” as its referred to by the occult and through my studies I can confidently say that none of it works. I’ve studied the golden dawn I’ve studied Allister crowley’s work, I’ve read grimwars from wiccans, looked at individual works of religious mystics and shamans. None of it works and yet the magic I now do is almost real while also being a lie.
On to my political view, I’m wholeheartedly An independent right in the middle I came to the realization that we argue politics separate from religious practice while both sides seem to avoid logic and reason. I’m an atheist who doesn’t agree with abortion unless necessary for population control as I’ve always said a life is a life no matter the state its in. I don’t understand why Christian right wings aren’t pro choice i mean you believe in an afterlife. Excuse the rant. To me there is nothing after this and with all the cool shit in the world i wouldn’t want anything alive to miss out on its experience. That includes the fetus. I’m absolutely pro gun control I live in fucking colorado where it started and i really don’t think people need guns. I’m absolutely pro freedom of speech as it is Aligning with the law of Do what thou wilt. Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law, Thou has no right but to do thou will do that, and no other shall say nay. I’ll let this mull over.
I hope theres no offense taken by this question but how old are you?
None ever taken I’m almost 30.
Can you support this claim, do you have anything approaching objective evidence?
Well this depends how one defines computer, the Antikythera mechanism dates to (200-70 BC), and because it used gears to calculate astronomical positions. is thought to be the earliest computer.
I am dubious, can you support this claim?
We never allow anyone to use another persons body against their wishes, even if it was to prolong the life of another, so why would we do this for blastocyst, a microscopic clump of insentient cells, or a developing foetus?
On this we are in agreement, the obsession with private gun and firearm ownership in the US is driving some truly gruesome statistics.
FYI, if you have a long post, it helps the reader if you break it down into paragraphs, many people claim to find a wall of text harder to read.
Lets see, the countless amounts of freemason lodges are just one example of evidence as this secret society is clearly real and if you read from their rites the higher members are clearly representing the occult. The golden dawn is very open about this if you can manage to speak with them. In fact i would say most conspiracy theorists have poorly mistaken the golden dawn for the illuminati. Which is still real but not what conspiracy theorists are claiming they are. The word occult is simply an umbrella term for secret societies that fall under luciferian practices, though most societies avoid revealing this as it comes with misinterpretation that they may be “devil worshipers” more evidence would be I’m simply telling you I’m part of the occult.
Please clarify this i feel im misinterpreting you.
Well this might be evidence that there are people who believe in the occult, it is not objective evidence that those beliefs in the occult are justified.
Again, this is evidence that people believe in the occult, it is not objective evidence that those beliefs are real or part of objective reality.
If you refuse women a termination, you are creating laws that allow a blastocyst (a microscopic clump of insentient cells) or a developing foetus, to use the body of that woman against her will. I can see no justification for this.
Oh yes I agree. The “magik” practices don’t work I’ve tried. I thought you were making the statement that the secret societies of the occult weren’t real, because they are very much real. Just their claims are a little wacky.
This is assuming we have “will” or “free will” mind that phrase as an atheist. Does the organism deserve a chance at life though? As this is the only one it has a chance to experience? By this logic you were the same clump forcing your mother to birth you. But as living things born we’re now separate and don’t rely on a “host” except the planet that provides us with energy. In my view nothing justifies death unless its natural. You can argue that the killing of something is entirely natural because a natural thing as a human is doing it but than by that logic we should all rape murder and commit suicide because its only natural.
I wont dehumanize a human fetus thats like saying eating a steak is ok because i didn’t watch it get beaten and then slaughtered. All living things are animals and either all deserve a choice or none do including the fetus.
Can you tell I’m vegan? Lol
So you ask and poof… what did my age have to do with this?
Well we perceive some autonomy of choice, if you’re saying we have none that’s determinism or fatalism. If that’s the case then any attempt to define morality would be pointless.
No one has the right to use the body of another person against their will, even if it meant their death. Though the current scientific evidence suggests that a developing foetus is insentient.
Nope, that was entirely her choice not mine.
Correct, and what’s more we still wouldn’t let a fully formed sentient human being, use the body of someone else against their wishes, even if it meant that person would die. So why would we entertain giving this right to blastocyst or developing foetus?
The existence of the blastocysts or foetus is impossible without the woman’s body, but it must be her choice how her body is used.
If a grown man were dying of kidney failure, and the only donor was his father, and that father said no, we wouldn’t remove his kidney anyway against his will, even if his son would inevitably die.
There was no single catalyst. The Mechanical Turk would have been a minor inspiration. Charles Babbage’s Analytical Engine, Turing’s work at Bletchley Park and Von Neuman’s work at the Institute for Advance Studies would be probably more relevant. On top of that, the simple need to scale society, such as the development of Hollerith cards to facilitate the US Census in the early 20th century. Or as the saying goes, “necessity is the mother of invention”.
All living things are animals? Aren’t plants living things? Are bacteria living things? Are fungi living things? Are algae living things?
You can’t dehumanize something that isn’t yet human.
Do you refrain from eating eggs because they are a proto-chicken, and you fear hurting chickens? Don’t eggs have rights?
Are you aware that the concept that “life begins at conception” was an invented wedge issue of the 1970s, to keep fundamentalists cohered around a political issue at a time when it was not desirable to be open about their real concern, which was school desegregation – and their real problem, which is that they were bigots? The doctrine was famously derided as “The doctrine younger than a MacDonald’s Happy Meal”. In the years leading up to this “life begins at conception” nonsense, evangelical publications openly wrestled with the question of whether a fetus was a person. Inconceivable just a couple of generations later – but that was the situation.
You may be unwittingly influenced here by conservative religious ideation. To my knowledge, prior to about the mid 1970s, no one was arguing that fetuses were persons – only speculating about the possibility and mostly leaning away from it. Because, as they say, if an egg is not a chicken and a hunk of steel is not a car, then neither is a fetus a person. In fact if current research is any indication, fetuses are not even sentient, at least not at the developmental stage where they are usually aborted.
One thing I gotta give conservatives credit for: they know how to frame and market an idea and play the long game while doing so, until everyone sort of accepts it as given, even its opponents.
I agree, though i did like Matt Dillahunty’s response on this, I am paraphrasing, but when someone said it was a life, he basically said “I don’t fucking care, I don’t care if it’s in there writing fucking poetry, it’s still doesn’t have rights over a woman’s body.”
You gotta love Matt.
He’s a vegan. 
I will say i have heavily examined this possibility and I will have to agree that it sounds like that but wgat I’m saying at the base is all things deserve life because whats left is nothing in my atheistic world view here. Its a matter of the fetus weather its Sentient or not will go from existing to not existing. I propose something that allows for pro choice mothers to have the abortions they choose and still keeps the fetus alive just have a plant where scientist grow them outside the mother. I know this sounds grotesque but they can remain alive experience life and contribute to science. That wouldn’t be difficult and wouldn’t harm the mother… I feel I may get shade for this.
It’s clearly stated that the turk was the first example seen by a mathematician that inspired the first computer once he got to look under the hood so to speak. Another example is thumpers, if you don’t know what that is it is a small device that vibrates coded messages to you a really cool example would be mental die a magic product sold on penguin magic. Thumpers are now being given to football coaches to communicate with their team. I just googled “What scientific advancements have come from magic and magicians” and it gave me nothing. Mostly because these sort of things aren’t easily shared with the public. One such thing I’m not at liberty of giving the name is a device that allows you to transmit a thought into someones head using sound waves. This for magicians was used to force a word on the spectator. The c.i.a saw this as opportunity to use it to sway peoples actions and behaviors. It fortunately doesn’t work like that. I would even go as far to say that because of this type of magic we no longer live in the dark ages. The Discoverie of Witchcraft is a book published by the English gentleman Reginald Scot in 1584, intended as an exposé of early modern witchcraft. It contains a small section intended to show how the public was fooled by charlatans, which is considered the first published material on illusionary or stage magic. Because of magic “magik” and the supernatural was exposed as being fake.
Yes and in this statement I’m considering all living things here as animals.