How does it work?

6qkgj3

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Sometimes it doesn’t.

That nailing torture stuff requires attention to detail, apparently.

SFKp

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Paul Foster in The Expository Times 123 (3), 122-124.

”This study pursues the claim that Jesus never died on the cross. Though sensationalistic (especially in the hands of the media), the claim is ultimately anticlimactic and sober. Samuelsson investigates every instance of the language of crucifixion in ancient Greek, Latin, and Hebrew sources: Homer and Aesop, classical historians and philosophers, playwrights and orators, Hellenistic and Roman historians, ancient papyri, Roman philosophers and poets, as well as texts from the Hebrew Bible and Second Temple Jewish literature, and finally the NT… This study is highly persuasive.”

Gunnar Samuelsson; Senior Lecturer

Department of Literature, History of Ideas, and Religion

His assertion, after an extensive review of all relavant literature, ‘There was no Crucifixion.’ Of course the JW have known this for a century. Crucifixion on a cross is not supported by historical records.

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They have recently found remains–in the holy land–that date back to the Roman era that show signs of crucifixion.

I believe that a Jesus of Nazareth probably existed, and that he was just the first reformed Rabbi.

There is even speculation that Jesus was actually twin brothers, and the resurrection was simply the surviving twin.

Re: How does an instrument of torture and death become a symbol of inspiration?

Hell, Dale Earnhardt was killed in a bad wreck during a NASCAR race. And to this day the NASCAR “worshippers” proudly disply his car and the number “3” in various ways (t-shirts, hats, jewelry, etc.) as an inspiration to their beloved racing “god”. Sooooo… (shrugging shoulders)…

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THIS IS ALL YOU HAVE
“In Christian tradition, nailing the limbs to the wood of the cross is assumed, with debate centering on whether nails would pierce hands or the more structurally sound wrists. Romans did not always nail crucifixion victims to their crosses, and instead sometimes tied them in place with rope. In fact, the only archaeological evidence for the practice of nailing crucifixion victims is an ankle bone from the tomb of Jehohanan, a man executed in the first century CE.”

The earliest image of the crucifixion is a late second-century graffiti mocking Christians. Called the Alexamenos Graffito, the image shows a figure with the head of a donkey on a cross with the words: “Alexamenos worships his God.”

“Scholars think that the Constanza gemstone, as it is known, dates from the fourth century CE. In this depiction, Jesus’s hands do not appear to be nailed to the cross, since they fall naturally, as if he is tied at the wrists.”

Comment: Was Jesus really nailed to the cross? - Archive - News archive - The University of Sheffield.

image

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If they have great but it is a well documented fact that crucifixion, spiking (placing the victim with knees up on a large sharpened stake) scourging, dressing in thorns and single stake crucifixion was a very common form of execution in the the 1st to 5th centuries under Roman occupation. It is a practice that is not in doubt. The history and pathology of crucifixion - PubMed.

A Jesus of Nazareth may have existed but there is just no corroboration of that assertion. None. Certainly not the magical apocalyptic jesus figure depicted in the gospels.

There is a host of speculations about the legendary jesus of the gospels. In fact the gospels themselves are speculation and folk tales. Without contemporary corroboration one can safely disregard all the puffs of hot air about the subject.

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I don’t neccesarily disagree with you. The human tendency toward confabulation is well known.

When I was a paramedic, I often saw how the details of a memorable 911 call could become distorted and twisted over time to suit the agenda of the story teller to the point where it becomes ridiculous . . . especially in a bar when recounting one’s own heroism in order to get laid.

So I don’t see the gospels as having any more credulity than the Greek legends of Heracles defeating the Hydra, or Odysseus and his crew being detained and eaten by a giant cyclops.

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“Hey bartender, give the lady here another beer, and I’ll have an Adios Mother Fucker”
"Oh thank you Jesus, That’s so sweet of you…’
“So, anyway, Like I was saying. There I was standing trial before an improperly convened Jewish cout, the victim of lies and ridicule. I was spit upon, blindfolded, slugged, and slapped by those bastards who belong to the Sanhedrin. Then the fucking guards took me out and beat me. It’s a good thing I took a martial arts class once or I never would have survived. Look here, see this, I chipped a tooth and my robe is torn. And look how dirty my feet are. Anyway, after that, the sun started coming up and everyone started mocking and taunting me again. I just told them, 'Sticks and stones will break my bones but words will never hurt me. I’m rubber and you are glue what you say bounces off me and sticks onto you.”

"Wow! That’s really smart.’

‘Yea, I just made it up.’

‘This is my friend Sally, can she have a beer too?’

'Sure, Barkeep. Another round here please… Now where was I? Oh, yeah, I was getting mocked again. The soldiers got this rose bush thing and made a hat out of it and then shoved it on my head. Look here, I still have a scratch."

Oh you poor baby. Did you go to the hospital.

Naw! I just thres some alcohol on it,. I’ll be fine. So anyway, after that, this fucking asshole named Pilate had me flogged. Oh not with a regular flog. I got flogged with a flog that had strips of metal tied into it. It ripped into my back, tore out my spine, well hell, if I wasn’t the all powerful son of god, I probably would have pissed my pants, but hey, I was sent here to be a sacrafice and so that is what I’m gonna do.

Ohhh YOu are so brave.

Aww… any god worth his shit would do the same. Bartender, another round here. So after the flolgging,. which by the way ripped out my eye as well as my spine.

But I can see your eye, it’s right there.

Shhh Sally,k your interrupting the story. He put it back in and it got better

Yeah, that’s it, I put it back in and it got better. So they led me like a sheep to the slaughter and even forced me to carry this big fucking wooden cross. It was this tall, gesturing, and this wide, gesturing. It must have weighed a thousand pounds. I even fell on the rough street and look, I stubbed my big toe, and that’s probably how my toga got torn. I should probably sue those assholes. I think one day I will just have a really nice party and not invite them.

But you’ll invite us, won’t you Jesus. (running her fingers through his beard).

You bet! You two are top on the list. Hey, your ready for another?

Well, I suppose you could always twist a girls arm. Thank you Jesus.

"Barkeep, set them up! Another round please. So I had to drag that fucking cross all the way through town and up to that hill. Golgotha? You know the place where they dump all the garbage. Then the fuckers nailed me to the fucking cross and left me there. I sat there for hours until finally some wise ass stabbed me in the abdomen with a spear. Look, here is the scar?

That looks like an appendix scar.

Shhh! It’s just a coincidince it looks like an appendix scar. He was stabbed with a spear. So what happened next.

Well there I was, nothing to do but die. Okay, I thought about calling out for John, and then when he got there telling him that I could see his house, but that’s an old dying on the cross joke and I didn’t want to use it. Besides, I was supposed to be the perfect sacrifice, so I died.

You Died?
You Died?

Well, I got better. Three days later I woke up in a cave and I felt fine. So hey, which one of you bitches wants to go home with me tonight and experience heaven.

That’s the stupidest fucking story I have ever heard, your going to have to do a hell of a lot better than that. Thanks for the beers. Come on Sally, let’s get outta this place.

You’ll burn in hell if you don’t fuck me tonight.

Oh go fuck yourself you piece of shit.
Yeah, why don’t you try your shtick on an alter boy. I hear they’er easy.

You be sor… (Hmmm? Alter boy?)

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If he had been decapitated on a guillotine would they all be wearing little ones around their necks?

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Getting decapitated by an axe or a sword would have been cooler. Just imagine… Axe/sword earrings… Awe/sword necklaces… Axe/sword decorating your walls… A bad-ass looking sword on display in the rear window of your pickup truck… Hell, lumberjacks would be held in much higher esteem, for that matter… Oh, wow! And brandishing a sword in public would be considered a protected religious practice/right. Yippee!

Although, I’ve often wondered what the jewelry/trinket symbol would be if Jesus had been drawn and quartered. Seems like there would be some competition there with the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse… :thinking:

Charm Bracelet
Quartered

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:joy::joy::joy: Genius idea! :joy::joy::joy: Now, just imagine that scene being acted out in all the Passion Plays around the world every Easter.

Edit: I would love to be part of the special effects crew for one of those!

I got the theme song. Alan Jackson - The Old Rugged Cross (Live) - YouTube

On a hill far a-way
there were four rusty chains
The emblems of suffering and shame.

And I love those old chains
where the dearest and best
of a world of lost sinners was slain

So I’ll cherish the old rusted chains
that quartered my saviour’s remains
And I’ll cling to the myth that contains
Old stories that ease all my pains.

The four rusted chains will always be true
and their stains and their meat chunks I’ll wear.
On a bracelet on my wrist, that’s where I’ll keep all the bits
of my precious lord savior I swear.

So I’ll cherish the old rusted chains
that quartered my saviour’s remains
And I’ll cling to the myth that contains
Old stories that ease all my pains

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We would need to change some songs.

He had the whole world in his hands.
He had the whole world in his hands.
He had the whole world in his hands.
He had the whole world in his hands.

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I’ve got a piece of his liver
I’ve got a piece of his liver
I’ve got a piece of his liver
on my wrist.

I’ve got a piece of his liver
I’ve got a piece of his liver
I’ve got a piece of his liver
on my wrist.

I’ve got arms from his body
I’ve got legs from his body
I’ve got toes from his body
on my wrist.

I’ve got lungs from his body
I’ve got a rib from his body
I’ve got a foot from his body
on my wrist.

I’ve got ears from his body
I’ve got eyes from his body
I’ve got a nose from his body
on my wrist.

I’ve got (beep) from his body
I’ve got (beep) from his body
I’ve got (beep) from his body
on my wrist.

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Holy shit, I will never unhear this now.

Just like my favorite Christmas song,

Joy to the world,
That Barney ‘s dead
We chopped off his head!

What happened to his body
We flushed it down the potty

And round and round it went
And round and round it went

What other songs can we rewrite?

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I have several “Christmas songs” I’ve re-written over the years.

Ah yes…:notes: Cog’s nuts toasting :musical_note::notes: on an open fire…Tin-Man :notes: squeaking with delight. :notes:….I can just hear the crackling fire…:gift:

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