Hello:
I am not here to debate. I am new to this forum. I a married man with kids and grandkids, living in a very religious community. I have recently had many doubts and am coming to the conclusion that i no longer believe in the god taught by my religion. However, I am too deeply into the lifestyle and cannot just pull out without causing major damage to my life and the people I love. I am posting to see if anybody out there is in a similar situation. Thank you
Hey Marc, welcome to the Atheist Republic.
Well, Iâm not married or with kids but I do live in a country, society and family full of religious people. My circumstances were such that the pain that religion caused me was evident for years, in both physical and mental form. I was going to psychologists and therapists, psychiatric hospitals and whatnot.
The point is, I had to announce that Iâm outta this shit when I was on the brink of suicide. So, everyone in my family knows this about me.
I donât think pulling out should cause major damage to your life and the people you love (for example, in a Muslim marriage, if either spouse changes their religion, the marriage is nullified). Youâre changing your beliefs, not theirs. Unless Iâm wrong, and you mean more extreme by âpulling outâ
Having a religious wife is not a problem as long as she knows, understands and respects your lack of belief. Have you tried to talking to her? As for your kids and grandkids, once again, I donât think you should talk to them at all, unless they all live with you. Iâm assuming your wife is the one whoâs with you all the time so sheâs the one to whom you should reveal your doubts first.
The best way to approach a family member about your lack of beliefs or doubts thereof is to NOT attack their beliefs, but rather take the neutral approach and become the questioner.
For example, âhow do you know thereâs evidence for godâ instead of âyouâre wrong, thereâs no evidence for godâ. Since Iâm young (21), I didnât try to change anyone in my family. They all know Iâm an atheist and we respect each other now, but mostly I have to tolerate a lot of religious advice and stuff from them. But, so what? I ignore it. It doesnât harm me, I donât even believe in it.
On religious festivals, I have to sometimes perform along with the other people of my religion, not because I believe in it, but because I donât wanna make my family feel like Iâve ditched them or something. Iâve adapted to them, instead of trying to make them adapt to me. Iâm an ex-Muslim, by the way.
Welcome to the community.
If you tell your family and friends. Yes. They will be upset. Yes. You will get harrassed for awhile over it before everyone in your life quits caring about it and they quit treating it like itâs an issue. Yes. You will lose friends and yes. It might ruin your marriage and it might now. But you will find out who your true friends are after itâs over.
I myself embraced my atheistic lifestyle when I moved out of my mothers house at the age of 18. Most of my friends did not believe in God and they were not Christian. They gave a lot of their influence and we had long discussions and made assertions about how we believed it was bullshit and that God was fake and all of the other gods and religions were fake. We talked about how the bible was bullshit and that none of it existed. We talked about how there was no evidence that Jesus was real. On and on we went with those conversations. I had maybe 2 friends that were Christian and they didnât like that I separated myself from their religion. Weâre no longer friends as a result.
I am 35 now. My family knows Iâm Atheist and has known that for years. My mother and brother were deeply hurt and offended by it for a very very long time. It caused fights between me and my ex wife even though she married me knowing damn well that I was not a religious person.
Whatâs funny is after my divorce. My brother tried helping set me up with a few women for dating. Heâd be like âI donât think this one will work, sheâs Christian and I know youâre not into that.â or on another girl heâd be like " sheâs Christian" with his deep voice and Iâd laugh. I always found his commentary on the subject rather funny.
Now my family donât give a shit anymore which is great. Theyâve accepted that is apart of who I am. Once everyone who loves you accepts the fact that you donât believe in gods and fairy tales and theyâre able to get passed all of the bullshit. Youâll find out who your true friends are.
It wonât be easy. BUT it is very very worth it. I think itâs worth the head ache rather than put up with years of being forced to go to church and pretend to bow and scrape before a god that you believe is imaginary.
I was raised in a very controlling religious atmosphere.
I left at 30 - over 20-some-odd years ago. It did âcostâ me my family and friends since childhood and a marriage. I still live in the community and am treated by other religious members as though I am dead. In other words, Iâm shunned.
Over two years after I left, I had two siblings follow me out. 
I had to get to a point where I would be OK truly on my own. I build a little support system through co-workers (kept boundaries, itâs not their job to âfulfillâ my needs, but if I needed a beer after work, or could vent a little at work, I had some closer co-workers).
Anyway - each person depending on their circumstances makes the best decisions for themselves at the time. Circumstances change tooâŚ
Enjoy your time here! Welcome!
Loads of people have been and we see posts like this frequently. Many of the posters are stuck in Islamic countries where âcoming outâ can mean serious problems, even threats of death.
Whether or not anyone is currently sharing your situation, this is certainly a place to have some of your questions answered. Loads of very helpful people on the site and a wide array of different experiences. Welcome to the âAR.â Hope you enjoy your stay.
Hi Marc, welcome to AR.
At the very least you should find some like minds.
I donât necessarily agree with the âitâs worth itâ claims. Such an experience can be very painful and costly in terms of relationships.
From your post , it seems that at this point you only have doubts, but have not made a firm decision. Perhaps ask some questions about doubts you have. Here is good safe place. When you have enough information to make decision, do what feels right for you, without direction from others, no matter how well meaning.
Hi Marc
Welcome to the forums. You will find a kind, compassionate, forthright community here.
I cannot imagine what your life must be like in a community where outward conformity is necessary to avoid the pain and social isolation you describe.
Keep talking. it will help.
Thank you. It is true that I am not a âfull blown atheistâ. I have many doubts and have rejected the standard answers and beliefs. That does not make me an Atheist; I am closer to being Agnostic. However, the main point for me is that I donât think it is a responsible act for me to just puruse my own âtruthâ regardless of the consequences to my loved ones.
Thank you for listening.
Why not? And why would their be consequences? Can you be more specific?
I think you really need to elaborate what you mean by this pursuit of truth.
I did mention before that changing your belief does not have to change ANYTHING externally. Youâre still the same guy, with the same body, same family and everything is the same. Youâre changing beliefs and that is internal. Your beliefs are not physically affecting anybody. They can affect others mentally if you start forcefully imposing them.
Iâm getting the idea that you fear that you will have to abandon your family, wife or kids if you sought out the truth? It doesnât have to be that way.
Youâre being hesitant. Please share everything so we can all help you together.
You have used âAgnosticâ incorrectly. Everyone is Agnostic. Christians are agnostic. Atheists are agnostic. Anti-theists are agnostic. God is a non-falsifiable claim. There is nothing anyone acthally knows about god. Pin a theist down and all you will end up with is their last ditch effort to hold onto their belief, âWell⌠you gotta have faith.â Faith is not knowledge. There is no knowledge. (Hence⌠they are Agnostic.)
Atheism is about what you BELIEVE. It is a response to a single question. âDo you believe a god exists?â The answer is âYesâ or âNo.â The answer may be âsometimes.â The answer can not be âYesâ and âNo.â At this moment you either believe or do not believe. Atheism is about âbelief.â
Agnosticism is not about belief. It specifically addresses what you know. What KNOWLEDGE you actually have. You are correct, you have no actual knowledge about any god that may or may not exist. You are just like everyone else. If you think you have some knowledge, please feel free to share. I would love to hear about it. You are definately Agnostic, but being agnostic says nothing at all about what you believe.
So Marc⌠âDoes God Exist?â Yes or No? There is no middle ground. Whether or not you "knowâ you do have an opinion. You do fall on one side of the fence or the other.
I can understand the situation that youâre in, but you need to live your life for yourself first. Iâm a life-long atheist that was forced to pretend I was Catholic until I was in my teens before my parents gave up on me. When my wife and I got married, neither one of us practiced any religion, but after our son was born, she became a Christian and lectured me for years about being a non-believer and what was going to happen if I didnât accept jesus.
We fought about it for years before we âagreed to disagreeâ on the subject. Weâve been married for almost 40 years now, we have 2 kids and 4 grandkids. Theyâre all devout christians and Iâm the family heretic. Being an atheist doesnât have to change âwhoâ you are, just what you âbelieveâ on the subject of god. Itâs like the old saying âreligion and politicsâ.
If you have to hide your lack of belief and still participate in family rituals/ceremonies, youâre not being true to yourself and will end up miserable. If you choose to reveal this, talk to your wife first and just ask her what evidence there is for her "godâ other than faith.
There is also a you-tube channel called THE ATHEIST EXPERIENCE that features an ex southern baptist named MATT DILAHUNTEY that has a way of explaining his story and how he came to be an atheist after believing for 25+ years that makes a lot of sense.
And if you choose to come out as an atheist, and if she divorces you, takes the kids, the house and the car, and the friends that you once had are all theists and on her side, you will also be miserableâŚ
You are yourself whether or not you are âoutâ as an atheist. You are yourself, as an atheist, staying quiet and keeping the peace, and you are yourself speaking out and dealing with any issues. You are always yourself.
So weigh your decisions as carefully as you can and then just do like the rest of us. Put one foot in front of the other, deal with issues as they arise, stop to smell the roses on occasion, try to have a few meaningful goals, and get through another day,
I would caution that, because of the immensity of the decision, and the ramifications thereof, that you should first be absolutely certain of the conclusion that you think you may be coming to. Having doubts and âcoming toâ a conclusion are not the same as arriving at it. You should follow Truth no matter what - just be certain you are certain before pulling the trigger.
When you mentioned âtruthâ. What âtruthâ were you meaning exactly?
Thereâs no physical, historical, or any hard evidence of any deity or phrophet pertaining to Christian Mythology. Just bare claims.
If he/ she decides as in concludes that a deity is imaginary or fictional. I highly doubt there will any âspiritual damnationâ
I dealt with my families protests when I came out as a non believer of all religions. An Atheist. My family are Baptists. I think their god like all gods are imaginary and fictional.
Truth? Give me evidence. The Bible, The Qurâan, The Torah, The Pros EddaâŚthose are claims. They are not evidence.
I would disagree, the decision doesnât carry any more risk than disbelieving any other claim, unless of course you can demsonrate some objective evidence for your assertion.
Heâs not coming to a conclusion though, he is disbelieving one. Itâs claims that need to be properly supported by a demonstration of sufficient objective evidence, disbelieving a claim carries no burden of proof.
Theism is a belief and therefore the affirmation of a claim, as are all beliefs, atheism is not a belief nor therefore is it a claim, and therefore it carries no burden of proof, to claim otherwise is irrational. Itâs odd that theists and religious apologists only apply this irrational standard to their religious beliefs, and fail to see the bias, or that this is therefore closed minded.
True is defined as that which is in accordance with fact or reality. So unless theism can be supported by objective fact, the default position should be to withhold belief, or it is theism that is not following reality or truth.
Ignoring the tautology, and the rather silly hyperbole of the metaphor, one does not have to be certain a claim is false in order to disbelieve it, to claim something be disproved before disbelieving it is an argumentum ad ignorantiam fallacy. The burden of proof is with theism, as it is a claim, atheism is not a contrary claim, merely the absence or lack of belief in the claim any deity or deities exist. This is a common error religious apologists make here all the time, they put the cart before the horse, so to speak.
In my experience; when Christians turn love, truth, etc into proper nouns they often mean Jesus (or god/trinity/whatever), which might read:
You should follow Jesus no matter what
So they might have just been preaching, not debate.
eta: Iâm a bit more fluent in crazy than I like to admit.
I meant specifically that which is in accordance with reality.
As to your request for evidence, youâll have to be more specific as to what youâre looking for.
Thatâs not remotely specific, it encompasses literally everything, so it couldnât be more vague.
Oh no you donât, itâs your claim a deity exists, you canât claim to âfollow Truth no matter whatâ, and then not offer anything to support your belief when asked. Iâve lost count of how many theists come here and try this kind of sophistry.
It is up to you to be the first theist visiting here ever to start by demonstrating what you think is the most compelling objective evidence you have.
No atheist has to imagine what you need to demsonrate, in order to support your belief, thatâs epistemologically absurd, and intellectually dishonest.
evidence
noun
- The available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.
Thatâs pretty simple, start with the best you think you have, obviously.
Why canât the theists ask their god which argument will convince an atheist or two? An all-knowing and all-powerful god would surely knowâŚ