Wait-wait-wait… … Hold on a sec… … Did I just read that right?.. … YOU are calling ME decent?.. … That is amusing. Because coming from somebody who behaves as dishonestly as you do, I’m not sure whether to be flattered or insulted… … Moreover, considering how you believe your God/Jesus are the ultimate examples of “Moral Goodness”, it is almost disturbing to think what might be your idea of “decent”…
Edit to add: Oh, almost forgot. As for “rubbing me the wrong way”, don’t flatter yourself. You could not rub me the wrong way even with an automated carwash. All you did was simply reveal what/who you truly are. And once that happened, you became my “muse” (in a manner of speaking). You have inspired me to teach others how to spot folks like you so that they may avoid being duped during whatever future encounters they may face.
I’d probably quit dogging her if she’d just own up and admit she is unable to demonstrate objective evidence for the existence for any deity and knock it off with games, lies, and fallacious claims. She’s put more energy into deflecting, ignoring posts, and being evasive than I’ve seen any other theist come on here and do. She’s really dragging this out. She’s got an excuse and a story for everything.
I’m afraid it’s out of our hands, Dave. God has taken the reins. All we can do is pray that God will help Tia make the right decision. But at least we can take comfort in knowing that no matter what Tia does, it is all part of God’s Perfect Plan. Hallelujah!
A lack of evidence IS evidence of absence when that evidence is “REASONABLY EXPECTED.”
In the woods behind the ole Church is a cave, and in that cave lives a man eating bear. Every child knows the stories. We all grew up with the stories. We know the stories are true because hikers have seen the bear. People who venture near the bear’s cave have heard the bear. Yet, no one has actually tried to capture the bear. Let’s do that.
We begin by going to the bear’s cave and cautiously looking around. We don’t see any paw prints. We see no scat. We check the trees for scratch marks or broken branches and find none. We listen at the mouth of the cave but it is deep and dark and we hear nothing. Perhaps the bear is away?
We come back with trail cameras and some bait, ‘deer meat.’ we hang it high outside the cave where only a bear could reach. We bring our tents and we set up in the woods not far from the cave, and one of us stays on guard duty throughout the night, watching. No sigh of bear.
We sit out there for a month during the summer. We check the trail cameras regularly. We bait the mouth of the cave. Still, no sign of bear. We decide to venture into the cave.
Guns in hand, flashlights blazing, we enter the darkness and sink to the depths. No footprints in the soft soil, no scat, no bear smell, no bear sounds, and then the cave drops into an abyss. If the bear can fly, it might be down there? We return to the front of the cave.
There is no bear in that cave. An absence of evidence IS evidence of absence. We have 2000 years of BULLSHIT, inane assertions (people yelling BEAR, when there is no bear), apologetics (excuses, the bear is invisible, it’s away eating berries, it only visits on weekends, it resurrected but will come back soon).
We have looked. Absence of Evidence is Evidence of absence. Unless you can come up with some evidence; there is no reason at all to believe your silly claim. NONE.
Just a bear example? This reminds me of the Loch Ness sightings. They had a bunch of scientists show up at Loch Ness and get a ton of boats and scan the loch with sonar back and forth. They even hired divers to go swimming around. They never found evidence of the lake monster people were making claims about. Like you said in your bear story, there was an absence of evidence which is evidence of absence.
I love that example, I use it quite a lot. However, the answer I get most commonly is that I have to prove that no animal could ever set foot in that cave, in order to show that bear is not in the cave.
Funnily enough it goes to show that we invented god’s, because in that example humans are the only animals that entered the cave.
I also use, some idiot comes screaming into my house in the middle of the night yelling “Fire! Fire! Save yourself!”
"Look all over " No fire. "
“Where is the fire?”
“It’s coming soon.”
Next night same… Next night same… next night same, next night nextnight nextnight fuck me
2000 year later and still no fucking fire - I AM FUCKING TIRED OF HEARING THIS SHIT! By this time if the fucking fire ever happens it is going to be pure coincidence. A volcano will erupt and the fucking Christians will take credit for it and say, “See! We told you so.” Fuck me!
@Tia_Thompson I have a thought experiment if you are interested.
We shall keep in mind all the attributes of the god while discussing this.
You gave an example of a documented NDE (near death experience), all of that happened during some time span, few weeks as I can understand.
Let’s take that the guy in question was genuinely good guy and “deserves” a second chance.
So he gets in an accident (heat stroke or whatever), let’s call that zero point, so now we have a period of time where all of his friends and family started praying for him. At the end he wakes up, that would be the end point. So in the time span of just a few weeks, some group of people managed to contact god and get desired godly action.
Let’s ignore the fact that he had medical treatment the entire time, even unplugged he was not exposed to more detrimental factors.
Now just think about the number of children that have died in that specific time span, they also had friends and family praying for them even longer, sometimes for their entire life. Any kid should be more innocent than any young human, they are by all accounts pure. We know for the fact that more kids have died than miraculously saved. But most importantly this guy was in a coma, couldn’t feel anything, while these kids die in excruciating pain from entire palette of illnesses, starvation, animal attacks and natural phenomenas.
And that is going on for thousands of years.
Are we still keeping attributes of god in our mind?
Have you raised kids??? Been around them!!! Lol they’re little assholes.
Innocent in only the fact they are unable to “do” stuff. At home they lie, steal, beg, wreck stuff, fight, narcissistic…
My oldest, 3 yrs at the time, stole a “soap on a rope” because I said “no” in the store. He asked for a bath and was excited (fortunately, they’re also stupid). I of course saw it, recognized it, and drove him back to the store.
Made him apologize and give it back
The next time he did it, we drove to the cop shop. Had an officer talk to him .
THEN he stopped.
Innocent my ass.
Inexperienced and unable. That’s all that stops them wrecking havoc on the world.
Edited to add: Before you start shitting on me with “it was only a soap on the rope, why not just buy it for him”…
He had already picked his item. His treat. They are also greedy. I told him he could put the other back if he wanted the “soap on a rope more”. He said “no”.
While visiting a Wal Mart toy section last week, my wife and I spotted two pre teen girls taking big inflated balls out of the ball cage. They then hit them, volleyball style, far up into the air in various directions and laughed surreptitiously then did it again.
Their (I’m to assume) father eventually sauntered into the aisle and said at a fair volume, “Don’t be stupid assholes. You’re tracking those down. Let’s go.”
Our daughters have also done their share of acts in the same vein. Nothing at all wrong with calling kids out on their inevitable instances of stupid assholish-ness, IMHO; if parents fail to, those kids may grow into adults who will have a hard time doing the right thing to the best of their ability as a default behavior, in my experience.
I have two kids, girl (10) and a boy (11). I get what you’re saying, however I still stand by my statement.
For the purpose of my thought experiment, I can say instead, babies up to age 2. That would essentially eliminate your argument, but I don’t have to say that. It a natural occurrence that parents are responsible for their kids behaviour, in social animals.
I would see it as my personal failure if my kid misbehave.
LOL: You are such a nice mom: I ran six group homes. Boys, ages 8 to 18. (One of the many things I have done.) Okay, so, I am in my office and I get a call from the house parent. One of the boys hasbeen caught at the local Save-on Drug Store shoplifting. The police just called the house. There are 6 boys living in the house. The house parents do not have the time to round up all the boys, put them in the car, head over to Save-on, listen to the security guard bullshit, talk to the cops, miss dinner, homework, baths, etc… over one fuck up of a kid. That job is mine. And I have it handled. I tell the house parent not to answer the phone again until I get there.
20 minutes later, I am at the house. Just in time for the phone to ring. It’s the police. We are at the Save-on Drug Store and have one of your boys over here. He was caught shoplifting. Can you come down here and get him. “Yes sir. I just have to round up the other 5 boys and get them in the car. I’ll be there as quickly as I can.” Hang up the phone.
I turn to the other boys after hanging up the phone. “Who wants to see a movie?” Dumb question. Cheers from everyone. “Okay, wash up, eat dinner, and we are out of here in 30 minutes.” Couple of 7 minute showers. Wolf down the dinner, The kids are in the car and ready to go in about 40 to 45 minutes. Everyone piles into the van. It’s movie night.
We get to the movie and everyone gets popcorn and a coke. The movie lets out around 9:30. We all load back into the car and head home.
Now the kid that was caught shoplifting was caught after school. We got the call around 4PM. The movie started around 6 or a little after. It was now 10:00PM. The boy who shoplifted had been sitting with security in the Save-on security office for 5 to 6 hours at this point, unless of course the police actually took him to the station (VERY UNLIKELY.) I knew the boy was in custody, so I know he is safe. No problem.
All the other boys get ready for bed, happy as can be. And… the phone rings. “Hello!” “Is this the XXXX Treatment Center.” “Yes.” “This is officer” Ummmm "Smith. I have one of your boys with me who was caught shoplifting at the Save-on Drug Store this afternoon. Can someone come down here and pick him up. " “I’m sure someone can. I will have to call around. I am by myself and 5 of the children I am caring for are sleeping. I can’t leave the house. I’ll call around and get someone down there as quicly as I can.” Then I go and sit in the living room and watch TV. The house parents go to bed. Perhaps they are watching TV too. They have a private side of the home.
11:15 rolls around and there is a knock on the door. I can hear the cops radio before I ever get to the door. "Oh hello officer. I am so glad to see you. I have been trying to get hold of my director for an hour now. I just found out he took the wife and kids to Hemet for the weekend. I was going to suggest sending him home in a Taxi and I could pay the driver when he got here. I was just getting ready to call.’ “Well, we just couldn’t wait around any longer. I was told to put him in the car and bring him on over.” (I should have mentioned that the Save-on is only 2 blocks from the house. 5 to 10 minutes walking at most.) The boys walk past it on the way to school.
So, I thank the officer and tell him I will write him a letter of recommendation (and I do, I always do, when I use them like this). The officer hops back in his car and the kid enters the home. Waiting for him on the table is a peanut butter sandwich and a glass of milk. “Take a shower, eat your sandwich, and go to bed.” is all I say to him. While he is eating his sandwich, I ask him how his day went. He just looked at me and drank his milk. He knew exactly what I had done. “When you finish, put your dishes in the sink and go to bed.”
Natural consequences are always the best consequences. If you can figure out how to let a child suffer from his own mistakes safely, let him suffer. That was a day that kid will always remember. It’s a day I always remember too. (I’ve got several more just like it and then there was the first Social Worker who introduced me to the technique. LOL But that’s another story.)
Now that I have a format acceptable to at least three others:
After spending most of my lifetime disbelieving in anything, I found that believing in something does not mean I have to fit into a neat, little category. I don’t have to sing gospel songs on Sunday to believe in a higher power and be thankful, but if I want to do that too, I can.
I can agree with a quote by Henry Rollins about time, but I don’t have to agree with everything he thinks. I’m free. In a sea of atrocious deeds and many more atrocious words, I am free to search for what ismtrue and what is meaningful. The value of what is beneath and behind is what is important to me. Much like talking to y’all.
There are plenty of arguable things that pass in judicial systems. Before something goes to court in the first place, something has sit wrongly in someone’s heart.
Bullshit babble of a feel good, glassy eyed delusionist.
Why not just say; “I’m fucking asleep in my dream, don’t bother me!”
EDIT: The real problem with Tia is that she actually thinks she is saying something. I have a religious office mate that talks the same way. How these people manage to dress themselves in the morning is a mystery to me.
How nice of you to respond with a concise and rational explanation of what you are and how you got here, not what you are not, or reference others or babble meaningless pseudo philosophy.
I appreciate what you are trying to point out.
That article, as previously stated was a demonstration of that specific group of people’s evidence of God.
No matter what anyone tells them otherwise or what argument is presented, they will have an experience that will supersede doubt.
I wasn’t trying to convince anyone of miracles.
I truly think that in order to believe in miracles (as and adult) you’d have to experience one. You would also have to accept it as such. A couple of y’all have mentioned experiencing what others would call miraculous events, but you-yourself did not except them as such.
What can I do with that? Nothing. If someone has a “miraculous” event but calls it a happenstance, there is absolutely nothing I can do to change their mind. It would be pointless to try.
I have really complex ideas about the question you asked, and I answered it tonight best of my ability for.someone else with the story about Kelly. He was my personal experience in that area. He taught me step by step his opinions about unfortunate loss of life, and I trust he thought long and hard about it.
I consider his belief to be fire-tried.
.
item. His treat. They are also greedy. I told him he could put the other back if he wanted the “soap on a rope more”. He said “no”.