How do *some* atheists define their morality

Interesting claim.

You can prove that of course?

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I was wondering who would be first to mention this. I’ve dealt with too much theistic semantics over the years, not to be weary of absolute claims.

It is inherently subjective, however ripping your morals from religious texts by cherry picking through the often abhorrent moral worldview of archaic superstition is always going to end badly.

Now, how unruly must your child be before you take him / her to the edge of town, and stone them to death?

Sloppy wording, especially for an omniscient deity.

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Aha :triumph: just disposing of bad property. You can always make new property with the extra wives and sex slaves.

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We need to arrive at a common definition of “morality”. IMO theists define “morality” as commands from their god. My personal definition of “morality” differs.

So going by the theistic definition, they are not deluded, they just have a very limited imagination and lack of critical thinking skills.

If you are raised to follow religious commands without thinking or challenging, then delusion is not involved.

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There is a difference between humanity and humanism: humanity is the pursuit of moral excellence, or virtue. Humanism is the philosophy of self autonomy without divine input. Christianity is the opposite of humanism. Both Humanist and Christianity seek to know humanity through ethics (the observation and explanation of moral standards). But morality is not an object to be created, it’s a character trait. If Jesus Christ is divine, then he exemplifies moral excellence in a human being?

And if he is not, he insults the fuck out of a woman before helping her…not so ethical now is it?
I don’t think I would follow a racist divinity. Remember his instructions not to preach to anyone but the jews??

The fact is a divine jesus/Yeshua as described in the gospels is improbable, a very human jesus’s existence is “not proven”.

Accepting for the nonce that he existed, which I doubt.

I was taught that Jesus was both god and man.

My response; If he was man he was imperfect and capable of sin. If so, he could not also be god.

If he were god, he was perfect, incapable of sin, so could not be man***

*** I take the notion of god from the catholic teaching. EG a perfect and timeless being who has always existed .He is ascribed as being omnipotent, omnipresent and omniscient. Also infinitely forgiving and compassionate.***

***kinda demolishes the concept of an eternal hell.

That seems to imply that humans are divine (which seems odd to me to come from a theist).

@ebg

That post is a verbatim copy of one you’ve posted in another thread.

You’ve not bothered to address my response there yet.

Your claims for divine moral standard are naught but unevidenced subjective opinion, that is axiomatic.

How are immoral people behaving differently than their religions? Can you name a religion that actually has a moral foundation or a god that behaves morally? It makes perfect sense that Christians behave like the God they worship. It makes perfect sense that Muslims behave like the god they worship. Where’s the problem you speak of?

I know a pastor that runs a cult school .His name is pastor Marthino he hates jews and he admires Adolf Hitler .His cult use videos for brainwashing .Here is the most common video his cult use.

Here is pastor Marthino. He is a cult leader his cult worships him they call him “the son of Yahweh”.
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They used other videos as well .Note some of the videos were so offensive they were taken of by Youtube including “The slaughter of innocent Germans after ww2” it was hate speech documentary like video that hate speech Jews .

This from their website .


about cult
They never told me they had a website .I was heavily socially and love rejected and verbal abused there by young extremists this happened back in 2017 .That was my worst year (2017) ever this quote gives me nightmares .

Here is Charl a spoiled brat that shreds money.

That is my personal story I experienced at a cult .It is very painful for me to recall the cult school I will never forget how bad they treated me :sob: .They hate me because I am a peaceful and caring person :cry: .

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I think boomer47 has given you a comprehensive answer but i will add my own take on morality.

Firstly, morality is subjective. It changes from culture to culture and from time period to time period. Even in the most Christian of countries there was a time when marriages were arranged for girls barely menstruating. This is immoral to us today but was normal at the time.

The religious idea that morals came from God is deeply flawed. It often goes hand in hand with reference to the commandments in the bible but, as has been asked before, how did humans live long enough to reach mount Zion without morals and rules of behaviour?

If our morals come from God, they are handed down by authority.and breaking them brings punishment. In that situation, individuals do not develop a personal morality based on God, they simply develop an awareness of the risk of rule breaking.

In the British sitcom Afterlife, Ricky Gervais is asked, “If you don’t believe in God, why don’t you murder and rape as much as you want to?” He answered, "I do. I murder and rape as much as I want, which is not at all".

It seems clear that morals evolved as a way of helping humans live in larger groups. Any society must have rules to ensure the greatest possible well-being for the greatest number of people. Arbitrary rules from authority may be ignored but if they are backed with religious proscription they are likely to be more acceptable. Add the passage of time and you get the evolution of a moral code as a natural occurrence

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I have heard some theists propose that we are born with god’s graces and sense of morality. But IMO it is all BS.

Infants are born without any sense of judgement, and in their first few years they are lying, dishonest, stealing, manipulative, immoral monsters. That is the infant in them exploring their boundaries and learning social norms.

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yair.

I have an intense dislike of small children. I think they’re are a bunch of little psychos.—No empathy, no morality, no conscience, how else should they be described?

I can still remember the exact moment I grasped the notion of morality for its own sake and the arrival of my conscience. I was 12*** and royally pissed off I can tell you… Up to then I was a horrible little thief. That fucking conscience stopped me dead in my tracks. Have never stolen anything since. :innocent:

PS as long as you don’t ask me about intellectual property rights.

***Puberty arrived shortly after and I found a new favourite activity.

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Don’t worry I know how it feels so I empathize :cry:.The cult school gave hate speeches about Jews, Mulsims and blacks and other belief groups .
Pastor Marthino commonly preached this “Jews are very immoral and their hearts are full of hatred for the Israelites” .Here is a photo of Sunet Coetzee she makes armageddon threats .
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I was commonly yelled at by an extremist here is a photo of him :fearful::fearful: :sob: :scream:. His name is Louie he is always angry and he yells a lot :scream: :sob:. He once screamed told me “Whites don’t steal and murder they are not blacks !!!” :fearful: :fearful: :scream: :scream: :sob:. He also told me this “It is an absolute lie that whites can be criminals you are not an white person you are a race mixed Jew !” :scream: :fearful: :sob:.All I told him was “there are whites who are criminals and there are good black people”.

@anon72029883 I feel deep empathy for you I really appreciate your story thank you :heart: :yellow_heart:. Your story is very valuable to me :heart: :yellow_heart:. I was punished a lot by those extremists at the cult school just because I was different so I know how it feels .

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Careful mate. You’ve just made two affirming claims. Each attracts the burden of proof. Not sure if either claim can be proved. IE they’re each unfalsifiable (look up “Russell’s Teapot”)

I don’t believe in god(s) but make no claims because I cannot prove gods do not exist.

In my opinion, religions reflect the societies which invent them and the fears, prejudices, hopes and dreams of those who practice them. I base my opinion in a combination of a lifetime’s observation and study, both formal and informal. I concede that my opinion may be wrong. I look forward to any believer proving their religion has a divine origin.

I agree that morality does not seem to be innate. However, chimps demonstrate compassion and a sense of fairness… That suggests that morality may be innate, at least in part. It does not suggest anything divine.

The clip below demonstrates an understanding of fairness in chimps:

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They are not chimps. Cog will be looking for you now…

Dogs on the other hand…they don’t measure the quality of the “treat”. To them as long as each one has gotten something, it’s fair.

  • dogs, testing to see if dogs would become upset if they only got dark bread when other dogs received sausage, they found that dogs did not make that kind of subtle distinction. As long as the dogs got some kind of food payment, even if it wasn’t the yummiest kind, the animals would play along.

https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=97944783

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OOps. Slip of the pen. Of course they’re monkeys.