Believing in demons can turn you into one

Debate Room
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Okay, not an actual supernatural demon, but a pretty reasonable facsimile.
The journal of Ruby Franke, the women sentenced last month to 5 to 50 years in prison for child abuse was just released and is extremely disturbing. It’s even worse than I thought. Page after page of what it would have been like if the Spanish Inquisition ran a day care. It’s all about torturing and starving her 12 year old son and 9 year old daughter to drive out the demons and get them to “repent”. The 12 year old finally managed to escape to a neighbor’s house in the upscale Utah desert community. He wanted to be taken to jail because he thought that was what he deserved.
The neighbor (an older gentleman) cried while describing the boy’s condition to the 911 operator. Later an EMT had to walk away from the scene. It’s all eerily reminiscent of the Chad and Lori Daybell case where they killed her two kids because they’d become processed by demons. I can’t find just the transcript of the journal (I think it’s a court document you have to purchase), but it’s posted on youtube. Be warned:

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I saw things like this when I was a paramedic . . . especially with families from places like Haiti, Mexico, Nigeria, and Honduras.

They believed that exorcism was the answer for Tourette’s Syndrome, epilepsy (especially psychomotor and temporal lobe epilepsy), and homosexuality.

The exorcism process can often be quite brutal, and involves holding a child’s face under water, branding with hot metal objects, prayer relay marathons that cause extreme sleep deprivation, and withholding food.

The thing about this bullshit is that ministers feed into it by telling the family to distrust Western medicine . . . because if prayer doesn’t fix it, then it must be God’s will. The religious leaders have a vested interest, and this causes kids to die from treatable illnesses.

We see a similar dynamic when the children of Jehovah’s Witnesses die from want of a blood transfusion, or when conversion therapists use electricity, sleep deprivation, and beatings to “cure” homosexuality.

Exorcism is very relevant in the Haitian culture, as Catholicism and Voudun (ie: “Voodoo”) preach possession. A Voudun practitioner is “mounted” by a spirit (called a “loa”) during a ceremony, and this spirit can be spoken to, it gives advice, or it can inflict curses.

Baron Samedi–for example–speaks in a gruff voice, has no manners, and loves rum and tobacco. He is the loa of death and graveyards, and his wife is the loa Maman Brigette.

Papa Legba is a loa who acts like a toll-taker or gate keeper who allows a person access to the rest of the many loa. He is a wise old man who walks with a limp, and needs a cane or a crutch, and he has an affinity for crossroads.

I had the opportunity to see several Vodun ceremonies when I worked as a medic in South Florida, and it was very interesting . . . and even enlightening in its own way.

I will tell you that even though I dismiss the supernatural, I would never, ever–under any circumstances–underestimate the abilities of a powerful bokor . . . which is the title of a Vodun priest who works with the dark side of the religion.

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Things like this is what comes to mind when someone suggests there is no cost/harm to holding religious beliefs.

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I agree with you. 20 characters.

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I had a very big epiphany when I was exposed to Voudun . . . namely that the spirit world with the many loa seemed to have a striking similarity with Carl Jung’s “collective unconscious,” and the loa seemed to be very much like the “Jungian Archetypes” that we hear about in Jung’s writings.

I also see a similarity between the Voudun loa and the “djinn” of the Muslim world, the “Kami” of Japanese Shintoism, and–oddly enough–the “machine elves” of the DMT drug trip.

I always thought that Jung was a celebrated bullshit artist who conned academia . . . but as I got older, I realized that I was wrong.

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I appreciate you posting this, for the context. But I’m not going to watch it. I cannot even watch needles being stuck into an arm for vaccinations…on TV.

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At least the kids are still alive.

Sadly, magic man fetishists snuffed out an 8 year old autistic boy called Torrance Cantrell during one of these fucking “exorcisms”. That’s a case that will - and indeed should - elicit much rage.

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My thoughts exactly, sorry, but I can’t even watch kids crying on tv in an advert. What came to mind yet again was Voltaire:

“Those Who Can Make You Believe Absurdities Can Make You Commit Atrocities”

Though there is some doubt about the actual translation, it strikes a chord whenever we hear of such appalling cases, and sadly the abuse and even murder of children believed to be possessed by demons is not uncommon. There have been high profile cases in the uk as well. Truly heartbreaking stuff…

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It’s Utah, I’m not really surprised in the least. The state is basically just run by Mormon cultists at this point. The same state that brought us Warren Jeffs, another fine individual.

Check out “keep Sweet: Pray and Obey” on Netflix. Utah needs to be shutdown as a whole at this point IMO. I’ve never seen a state with more incidents of child abuse than Utah at this point. Mormons use children as slave labor to harvest crops and even work on job sites doing construction. The state constantly turns a blind eye to child abuse within religious institutions.

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It’s very hard to listen to and my hope is that it will be read at any and all of her parole hearings. This is a look at her motivations and actions in her own words. She pleaded guilty and there wasn’t a trial. A lot of things, including this journal, weren’t made public until after her sentencing. After hearing her journal entries it’s even more clear to me than it was before how dangerous she is.

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Hi! I don’t agree that believing in demons will turn you into one and just for the record I’m not one!

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Are you sure? Your head hasn’t been twisting around lately? No horns?

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I’m with GOML on this one. Not because I am squeamish, though. Never have been when it comes to needles, blood, guts, gore, and such. My problem is I cannot listen to these people who do such things to kids without my blood pressure going through the roof. Especially if the fucking oxygen thieves are still alive and breathing. Why would somebody like that EVER be considered for parole. Why are they not buried in a shallow grave somewhere in a swamp? Better yet, just cover them in chicken blood and toss them into a pool of hungry crocs while they are still alive. I would gladly help do that. Would even help my blood pressure go down a bit.

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How about metaphorically? Also who are you replying to? Use the quote or reply function.

Well you say that…but who can trust a demon?

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Ha! Exactly what a real demon would say. Nice try, Richard. But you will have to do better than that to convince us you aren’t a demon. Sure, some of us may have been born at night. Just wasn’t LAST NIGHT. :triumph:

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So I suppose that Factory reset we initiated doesn’t count? Come on…

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That was last week, not last night. And jess beecaws eyem steel ketchinup own my alfabits and nummerin figgerin, it dus knot mene eyem gullable. :triumph:

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I never did get any response to this from @RichardtheRaelian, does he have any thoughts?

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My left foot is talking to me.

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