I challenge your idea that “science is invented by men,” as science works whether you believe in it or not.
Did religion give us antibiotics? Anesthesia? Modern surgery?
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And I challenge your challenge 
My claim is that “science is invented by men” is factually correct. The scientific process and its methods are man made. So are scientific experiments and scientific theory and hypotheses. They are definitely not god-given. The results, however, are not invented. Empirical data are given by nature itself, and recorded by men through man-made measuring apparatuses. When it comes to the interpretation of the data, it is filtered through human brains, and interpreted with the aid of previous human scientific experience.
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I guess this depends whether you are talking about what science describes, or the description itself, as I’d say humans created the latter using the methods of science, but that what they are describing is objectively real.
A common false equivalence fallacy theists and apologists use, is to conflate the descriptive with the proscriptive. Laws need a law giver for example, a circular reasoning fallacy of course, but the laws are human creations, they don’t exist independently of humans, what they describe does though.
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I see your points, and I didn’t communicate well.
I didn’t distinguish between the findings of science and the process of science, and I really know better.
And I did not mean to imply that the process is God-given.
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Knowing some theists, they do employ that one argument that their god or gods gave us “science”. Especially with the DNA argument, Watchmaker analogy, Designer theories, etc. Always a way for Christian Apologists to move the goal posts lol.
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I would have been very surprised if you didn’t.
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Science was invented by men describing the world around themselves and then “Fact-checking” one another. Something Religion has failed to do since its inception. Men question perceptions and ideas. Religions put people to death for questioning perceptions and ideas. Science and men have made amazing advancements over the centuries. Religion, on the other hand, has struggled throughout the years to remain the same.
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I agree.
One of my issues with Christianity has to do with sainthood.
There was a microbiologist named Maurice Hilleman who specialized in vaccines, and he created over 40 vaccines in his life, which has saved the lives of over 225 million people . . . and most of them are children.
So, if God gives us brains and science, then how come Dr. Hilleman’s work doesn’t qualify as something miraculous? I see Hilleman as being far more of a miracle worker than any 1,000 saints combined.
It’s another religious double-standard.
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If anyone disagrees with me, please let me know.
***Squishy banana sound. Squishy banana sound. Squishy banana sound… Door Slams! The cute pitter-patter of little monkey feet running up the hill…
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Bullshit.
Atheism is, as I’ve already explained, nothing more than suspicion of unsupported mythology fanboy assertions. It has NOTHING to do with your fictitious “persecution” of Christians, who, you apparently need reminding, have entire publishing houses devoted to spreading their propaganda, entire TV and radio stations devoted to the same, and in the USA, an entire political party pandering to their frequently unpleasant prejudices.
Try learning some FACTS before posting next time.
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I’m curious.
When have atheists routinely persecuted anyone?
I suppose that you could make an argument that the former USSR was atheistic, and there were pogroms, Stalin starved millions of people, and so forth . . . but I believe that he would have been just as much of an asshole if he was religious. The People’s Republic of China is officially atheistic, and they are oppressive to their own people . . . but I don’t think that atheism has anything to do with it.
Places like Sweden, Norway, Denmark, Finland, France, and Switzerland have lots of atheists and very secular governments, and they are considered to be some of the happiest places on Earth.
As for equating Satanism with atheism, I imagine that we could argue that the Satanic Temple is window dressing for atheism, but all they do is work to maintain the separation of church and state . . . and while I agree with their philosophy, I don’t always agree with their methods.
As for religion, we have had horrible bloodshed for thousands of years . . . and bloodshed even today, when we should really know better.
And what happens if Christianity becomes the state religion in the U.S.? Do we pick an approved denomination? Methodists, Lutherans, and Presbyterians are fine, but Catholics and Jehovah’s Witnesses are not?
Out of the hundreds (if not thousands) of Christian denominations, which ones would you pick as acceptable state religions? And what criteria would you use for your selection process?
I am interested in your answers, and I hope to hear from you.
Oh! I know! I Know! Those fucking atheists persecute the Christians. Just ask any Christian. The atheists have been killing Christians throughout history. It’s a fact! Hitler was an atheist. Marx was an atheist. Mao was an atheist. The Pope was an atheist. Atheists are evildoers.
At least David was half right: “The fool says in his heart,” “There is no God.” Anyone with half a brain uses it.
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Leaving aside the hilarious grammar, I’d read “Christian persecution” as Christians persecuting people, and we have overwhelming objective evidence for this.
His initial premise is nonsense of course, a cursory read of the dictionary definition, or indeed any definition, of atheism is sufficient to disavow oneself of that idiocy.
Even if his lie were true, and a significant amount of atheists worshipped Satan, and persecuted Christians, it would remain a false equivalence to assert this were atheism. Atheist and atheism are describing two different things.
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Christian Nationalists are doing that now with their attacks on health care.
“State abortion bans harm religious freedom. They force a Christian conservative view of abortion upon all the residents of a state,” said Brittany Williams, State Policy Counsel for American Atheists. “Patients should have the freedom to make reproductive health choices without being forced to follow someone else’s religious doctrine.”
American Atheists expects further Christian nationalist attacks on health care. These bills often allow hospital CEOs, hospital boards, employers, employees, and even insurance companies to deny any health care service based on personal religious beliefs. This disproportionately harms patients in rural areas without secular hospitals, LGBTQ patients, and patients seeking reproductive care. In 2022, South Carolina passed one such bill. States like Texas and Florida considered these measures, but they did not pass during that legislative session.
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